I am very glad that the tackler is now a usable ship type thanks to the buff on drones, and that the devs have added a new drone for use against frigates, however as several threads on this forum have mentioned, t4 and t5 are swamped by double drone speed tacklers who drop drones, cloak and then run away. This is clearly a very tempting build for people who do not like being killed, but they then become rather useless for their team in most cases.
I would like to make a few suggestions that could help solve this problem. I do not think that the speed is the issue. Indeed speed is essential in a tackler in order to hunt down interceptors, therefore I do not propose to remove Cruise Engine from the tacklers. Here is what I do suggest, on the other hand:
Increase the cooldowns on the drones. Many tacklers drop drones on one beacon in Capture the Beacon mode, before running to the next beacon by which time their drones would have “cooled down”, ready to attack this second beacon. This would make the use of drones more strategical: timing and positioning would become more important.
Limit the tackler to one drone only. It would then have to choose between attacking interceptors or attacking frigates. It would also force tackler pilots to install slowing modules again, which many of them seem to have substituted by drones…
Only one drone can be active at a time. Activating the second one disables the first. Most of these speed tacklers drop both drones at the same time and hope that they both hit. There is no tactical consideration of who they are attacking and what ship type they are in. This way pilots will be forced to think: am I attacking a fighter/frigate, or am I attacking an interceptor?
Reduce the range of the drones. This way the tackler needs to take more risks while placing the drone.
Introduce another type of drone: the Counter-intelligence Drone. This would be a viable alternative to the two types of damage drones, and would be able to counter fully or partially the Microlocator and spy drone for the tackler and it’s allies. For example the Microlocator would “flicker” on and off when in the perimeter of this drone. This would be more of a self defense drone than an offense drone and would be a tactically interesting addition imo.
What are your thoughts? These suggestions could be used alone or in combinations, I’m not quite sure yet what would be best.
*summary of other suggestions from discussion in the thread:*
Drones consume a large amount of energy per second , stopping the tackler from using cloak and other modules. (Spongejohn)
Drones cannot fire while the tackler is invisible.
The tackler must be within a certain distance of the drones for them to be able to fire , say 1.5k.
- Reduce speed of fire of sentry drone (Davidgill in different thread)
- Tackler drones become missiles like Engineer drones (JasanQuinn)
I am very glad that the tackler is now a usable ship type thanks to the buff on drones, and that the devs have added a new drone for use against frigates, however as several threads on this forum have mentioned, t4 and t5 are swamped by double drone speed tacklers who drop drones, cloak and then run away. This is clearly a very tempting build for people who do not like being killed, but they then become rather useless for their team in most cases.
I would like to make a few suggestions that could help solve this problem. I do not think that the speed is the issue. Indeed speed is essential in a tackler in order to hunt down interceptors, therefore I do not propose to remove Cruise Engine from the tacklers. Here is what I do suggest, on the other hand:
Increase the cooldowns on the drones. Many tacklers drop drones on one beacon in Capture the Beacon mode, before running to the next beacon by which time their drones would have “cooled down”, ready to attack this second beacon. This would make the use of drones more strategical: timing and positioning would become more important.
Limit the tackler to one drone only. It would then have to choose between attacking interceptors or attacking frigates. It would also force tackler pilots to install slowing modules again, which many of them seem to have substituted by drones…
Only one drone can be active at a time. Activating the second one disables the first. Most of these speed tacklers drop both drones at the same time and hope that they both hit. There is no tactical consideration of who they are attacking and what ship type they are in. This way pilots will be forced to think: am I attacking a fighter/frigate, or am I attacking an interceptor?
Reduce the range of the drones. This way the tackler needs to take more risks while placing the drone.
Introduce another type of drone: the Counter-intelligence Drone. This would be a viable alternative to the two types of damage drones, and would be able to counter fully or partially the Microlocator and spy drone for the tackler and it’s allies. For example the Microlocator would “flicker” on and off when in the perimeter of this drone. This would be more of a self defense drone than an offense drone and would be a tactically interesting addition imo.
What are your thoughts? These suggestions could be used alone or in combinations, I’m not quite sure yet what would be best.
Tacklers were good before. After some good buffs, they are even better (cloak buff, drone buff, shield tank buff to jerry)
The main problem is that most people are using them wrong.
So far they are balanced, and a good counter to interceptors, as they should be. Drones are less than an annoyance to anyone else than an interceptor.
Make the drones consuming an amount of tackler’s energy per second and most of “drone poopers” will disappear.
It sounds like a good idea. However this would stop “tackle + drone” at the same time capability, and I think this is a useful tactic. It would be a shame. Also you could just counter this by increasing energy regen speed.
Maybe a different disadvantage such as reduced speed/manoevrability while the drone is active?
The main problem is that most people are using them wrong.
And this is why I am trying to encourage people to use them correctly with these suggestions. My aim is not to nerf tacklers, since I agree with you that they are now quite balanced. They are very deadly in the right hands but also easy to kill, which is how it should be.
By the way the FED Bear had sentry drones along way back as I can remember … and it was NEVER an issue.
Yes now we seem to have a tackler drone swarm … as recent domination game which had 8 drones …and 1 solo tackler siting on a beacon. :008j:
Talk about having to do a hasty retreat.
Not that I am all for Tackler drones … just wondering why such a OUT CRY because some people are finding ways to utilize a particular asset ? Kill the tackler and the drones GO AWAY.
And this is why I am trying to encourage people to use them correctly with these suggestions. My aim is not to nerf tacklers, since I agree with you that they are now quite balanced. They are very deadly in the right hands but also easy to kill, which is how it should be.
The problem is that all the stuff you are proposing are nerfs.
BTW drones had energy consumption before, and that was removed because nobody was using them, even with the buff to durability and damage. Making them free energy only is what made them what they are now.
I will work first in pulsing aura engineer (I found one guy in a NAGA!!! doing that, I can’t understand how is possible he reached tier 5 doing that)
It sounds like a good idea. However this would stop “tackle + drone” at the same time capability, and I think this is a useful tactic. It would be a shame. Also you could just counter this by increasing energy regen speed.
Maybe a different disadvantage such as reduced speed/manoevrability while the drone is active?
With low energy you can still fire, the problem is that you can’t cloack and escape. And i mean a LOT of energy drain by every single drones, the kinda of drain that can’t be handled when 2 drones are used.
And this is why I am trying to encourage people to use them correctly with these suggestions. My aim is not to nerf tacklers, since I agree with you that they are now quite balanced. They are very deadly in the right hands but also easy to kill, which is how it should be.
Terrorblade and Vk from NASA are using tacklers in t5 “how they deserve to be used” and they are really fierce opponents, not so easy to kill (even with my trolling Wakiwaki). All the others… well just not make me start again
By the way the FED Bear had sentry drones along way back as I can remember … and it was NEVER an issue.
Yes now we seem to have a tackler drone swarm … as recent domination game which had 8 drones …and 1 solo tacklet siting on a beacon. :008j:
Talk about having to do a hasty retreat.
Not that I am all for Tackler drones … just wondering why such a OUT CRY because some people are finding ways to utilize a particular asset ? Kill the tackler and the drones GO AWAY.
Yeah sentry drones have been there for ages, but they were useless before. The problem is that people are spamming them now. And also they are using the drones as an easy option, by dropping them and then cloaking.
It’s hard to kill a ship that can go invisible for fifteen seconds, travel at 700 m/s, and drop drones that attack you or your beacon defense drones without them having to do anything…
I use only the light drone, but in brawling, close range fighting, no speed tackler of anything. Most of what you propose there hurts my gameplay (energy drain? maneuvrability malus?, longer cooldown?) while my gameplay is what you probably call “proper”. So no.
What Evi said about the engies pulsing auras. There are people who are just bad, and that’s it. Don’t nerf everyone, thank you.
With low energy you can still fire, the problem is that you can’t cloack and escape. And i mean a LOT of energy drain by every single drones, the kinda of drain that can’t be handled when 2 drones are
That’s reasonable. And you just gave me another idea for a simple modification that would solve this: going invisible deactivates the drones! They are still there but do not fire. Or maybe you have to stay in a certain perimeter, say 1.5k for them to fire? I’ll add these three suggestions to the OP, as I think they are all feasible and would solve the issue.
Terrorblade and Vk from NASA are using tacklers in t5 “how they deserve to be used” and they are really fierce opponents, not so easy to kill (even with my trolling Wakiwaki). All the others… well just not make me start again
Yeah I have seen some very deadly tacklers, and without trying to boast, I have got some very good scores with drone tacklers in tiers 3, 4 and 5, carrying my teammates several times. I actually find speed drone tacklers to be the best counter against speed drone tacklers
I use only the light drone, but in brawling, close range fighting, no speed tackler of anything. Most of what you propose there hurts my gameplay (energy drain? maneuvrability malus?, longer cooldown?) while my gameplay is what you probably call “proper”. So no.
What Evi said about the engies pulsing auras. There are people who are just bad, and that’s it. Don’t nerf everyone, thank you.
I’m trying to find a balance: keep tacklers playable while reducing speed + drone tackler spam. It is no fun when 3 people out of 5 on your team run around the map dropping drones and not doing much else.
So you do not agree there is a problem in t5 PVP atm with these tacklers?
Forget the misuse of them. I hate the proper use of them.
Trackler uncloaks at 2k, with engine suppression and 2 drones vs my CO with RFB. yaaaa fun
I admit that I only get destroyed maybe 1 in 10 times and it normally requires other ships and my general modules to be out. Even on the 9 times I have to leave and asse before coming back. Once I come back the tackler is about ready to cloak again… Rinse and repeat.
Something should be done, but nothing too dramatic. An increase cool down would likely solve most issues. Alternatively just a slight decrease to the projectile speed on the sentry drone would be different possible fix.
I don’t normally just go in, drop drones and leave, I attack, dealing damage with drones etc, then go invisible if they look dangerours ;p Then get to an advantageous position to attack. If the rest of the enemy team comes I use the drones+attack to deal damage to that ship so they most likely die from allies, then retreat to safety.
I like more using the invisible to sneak up behind and deal all 3 damage types to sitting frigates The gravi beam is fairly good at slowing ships down although probably not as effective as the actual tackler mods in some cases like annoying fast intercecptors.
Good pilots can still kill a tackler fast especially the lower survivability Fed ones with high damage ships or using annoying ecm modules etc
The trade-off for 700m/s is the lower turn and no use of afterburners in a dogfight.
The gravi beam is fairly good at slowing ships down although probably not as effective as the actual tackler mods in some cases like annoying fast intercecptors.