Guards fight DEFENSIVELY. If you’re doing offensive work with them, you’re doing it wrong. Guards arrive in an area and kick everyone else out and make you stay out.
Guard modules are short ranged, so if you want them to affect an enemy, you need to be close enough.
tell me more about the 1300 m zone suppression 
Maybe I am wrong, if so call me on it.
But I find that the spread-nerf to Schrapnel Cannon was unwanted in that high number.
I find myself unable to hit anything not 200m in front of me, and even then half of my shot misses.
I say decrease spread by 25%, that should make it close range, but not melee range
Offcourse.
And anyway still don’t understand why the most squishy ships ingmae have to have the closer range… (it could make sense if they had at least best damage output ingame… but they toally haven’ìt)
These are two exceptionally stupid and suicidal options. The correct approach is to let fighters take the spearhead while interceptors screen them from attacks while you come behind them in frigates providing fire support and zone suppression.
Guards fight DEFENSIVELY. If you’re doing offensive work with them, you’re doing it wrong. Guards arrive in an area and kick everyone else out and make you stay out.
Sorry for nub questions / comments … I’m new to Guards, side effect of new progress system got me flying them now.
Sorry for nub questions / comments … I’m new to Guards, side effect of new progress system got me flying them now.
- Pre 0.9.0 - Guards led the frontlines … was that not it’s usual role?
- I mainly fly healer previously and attacking guardgineers were frowned upon etc etc and I received alot of comments saying if you wanted to attack or play frig up front, fly Guards. So what why the mixed info ?
- When inties had paper thin hulls (and they still do) - the logical approach is to send in the Guard first to tank the hits and inties swarm in and kill whoever is trying to kill your Guard or else. This does not apply now ?
Guards always work best surrounded by other ships, going anywhere by yourself is suicide since you literally have no measures of getting away. Prior to this patch they didn’t “lead” the pushes, they were the anchors. Usually you had a couple of fighters or intys try to give you a chance fo set up along the other frigs, once you set up you were in business.
Guard modules are short ranged, so if you want them to affect an enemy, you need to be close enough.
That’s the point. They completely removed any defensibility the Guards had. They can no longer act as area denial vessels, the modules only serve to protect yourself. Area denial has now shifted to LRF with Minefields.
Sorry for nub questions / comments … I’m new to Guards, side effect of new progress system got me flying them now.
- Pre 0.9.0 - Guards led the frontlines … was that not it’s usual role?
- I mainly fly healer previously and attacking guardgineers were frowned upon etc etc and I received alot of comments saying if you wanted to attack or play frig up front, fly Guards. So what why the mixed info ?
- When inties had paper thin hulls (and they still do) - the logical approach is to send in the Guard first to tank the hits and inties swarm in and kill whoever is trying to kill your Guard or else. This does not apply now ?
That’s the point. They completely removed any defensibility the Guards had. They can no longer act as area denial vessels, the modules only serve to protect yourself. Area denial has now shifted to LRF with Minefields.
Lolwut?
They didn’t remove anything from the guards but the minefields(Which were horrendously OP), they even buffed it’s Propulsion Mass Inhibitor radius!
Guards still got pulsars, PMI, the weapon-debuff thingy, missile shields etc. If anything a good guard protects himself AND others.
I don’t see anything wrong with guards, they are mostly fine exept for the Singularity Cannon killing it in 5 seconds(Though it does that to every role).
Anyway i really hope they will do something about Cov Ops Soon.
I mean… interceptors are bad made at all (one more: Glass cannon rule says: “U die in 3 shots, u kill in 3 shots” … in this game the second part is missing… u actually have the lower damage at all). … but at least recon are playable, ECM are probably even OP (not couse they have damage or something… this is just another rule in onile ggames…" everything can stop others from moving is op" and my personal add is “makes the game worst”) …
… cov ops are simply usless and stupid ships atm. Nuke carriers… that’s all…
Rank 5 guards are awesome, they are really strong in that tier. Wait till you upgrade and lose that 25% range bonus. 
- Pre 0.9.0 - Guards led the frontlines … was that not it’s usual role?
- I mainly fly healer previously and attacking guardgineers were frowned upon etc etc and I received alot of comments saying if you wanted to attack or play frig up front, fly Guards. So what why the mixed info ?
- When inties had paper thin hulls (and they still do) - the logical approach is to send in the Guard first to tank the hits and inties swarm in and kill whoever is trying to kill your Guard or else. This does not apply now ?
And the " 5 " is the most important part about Guards : A lot of people thinks guard, from each faction have the same gameplay, same positionning … NO !
Jericho’s Guard —> Defensive Gameplay
Federation’s Guard —> Offensive Gameplay
Depending of what you want to be able to do. It just need some time to study the base stats of each ships.
@Funkybacon : In fact the mass propulsion inhibitor and the signature masking range have been ninja nerfed in the 0.9.0, the signature masking had a range of 2100m for the MK3 and 1600m for the Mass propulsion inhibitor. (i’m sure for the signature masking, not for the mass propulsion).
We can blame or not the devs for that, but I can easily understand the interceptor’s pilotes if they didn’t change this xD Suicidal mission everytime they meet a guard.
Lolwut?
They didn’t remove anything from the guards but the minefields(Which were horrendously OP), they even buffed it’s Propulsion Mass Inhibitor radius!
Guards still got pulsars, PMI, the weapon-debuff thingy, missile shields etc. If anything a good guard protects himself AND others.
I don’t see anything wrong with guards, they are mostly fine exept for the Singularity Cannon killing it in 5 seconds(Though it does that to every role).
They buffed the Propulsion Inhibitor to 1300m. That gives you the defence radius of a banana, considering other ship roles can apply their debuffs at 3km+. And yes, I do realize Guard modules would be extremely OP’d if they went any higher than their current value, which irks me even more, it just means the Guard was ill-thought out for its job.
Rank 5 guards are awesome, they are really strong in that tier. Wait till you upgrade and lose that 25% range bonus.
And that is sad because, iirc, that bonus is nowhere else.
And that is sad because, iirc, that bonus is nowhere else.
I’m not in game atm but IIRC otherwise only ranks 12, 13 for Jericho and rank 14 for the feds.
The bonus should probably be 50% for all guards though. The design is a bit schizophrenic actually - they want to break up frigate balls and thus remove frigate close range weapons and give their opponents aoe weapons like the singularity cannon plus infinite missiles, but at the same time retain a ship that is designed around everyone hugging it rather closely if they want the incoming damage reduction buff.
The guard’s role needs some serious rethinking as far as I’m concerned. Just looking at the ranges, an engineering frigate has three times the range for heals and up to twice the range for aoe damage (compared to Mk.1 Pulsar). Makes no sense. The guard should at least match those ranges as a fleet support vessel.
And talking about utility, the engineer’s shield should be on the guard instead, you know it would make more sense.
PS: Wondering why we’re discussing guards in the 0.9.0 patch feedback thread though.
No worry, we are discussing how the patch affects roles/ships and propose changes.
They buffed the Propulsion Inhibitor to 1300m. That gives you the defence radius of a banana, considering other ship roles can apply their debuffs at 3km+. And yes, I do realize Guard modules would be extremely OP’d if they went any higher than their current value, which irks me even more, it just means the Guard was ill-thought out for its job.
And that is sad because, iirc, that bonus is nowhere else.
the modules are meant to protect from inty’s and fighters mostly. Which regulary are within 2km.
The 25% range bonus and 20% CD bonus switch with each itteration of the ship basicly. And guards really do not need their mods at 2km. Their current range is good enough I’d say.
I frequently fly a guard and I really don’t see their “wrongs”, but I guess everyone plays their guard their own way and notices things that are broken in their eyes.
@Funkybacon : In fact the mass propulsion inhibitor and the signature masking range have been ninja nerfed in the 0.9.0, the signature masking had a range of 2100m for the MK3 and 1600m for the Mass propulsion inhibitor. (i’m sure for the signature masking, not for the mass propulsion).
We can blame or not the devs for that, but I can easily understand the interceptor’s pilotes if they didn’t change this xD Suicidal mission everytime they meet a guard.
The mods were broken OP, and everyone knew it. They still grant full interceptor denial because interceptors currently have no means of dealing with large shields and no means of engaging enemies effectively at ranges over ~400m. That is why fighters got the singularity cannon, to stop guard from being ultimate attack and defense ship it was in 0.8.x. Now just like all classes, they have a clear counter that demolishes them and requires them to play as a team, rather than being the team.
The mods were broken OP, and everyone knew it. They still grant full interceptor denial because interceptors currently have no means of dealing with large shields and no means of engaging enemies effectively at ranges over ~400m. That is why fighters got the singularity cannon, to stop guard from being ultimate attack and defense ship it was in 0.8.x. Now just like all classes, they have a clear counter that demolishes them and requires them to play as a team, rather than being the team.
plasma gun, hits properly at 4km 
And singularity cannon is a counter to everything, not just guards.
plasma gun, hits properly at 4km
And singularity cannon is a counter to everything, not just guards.
I eat singularity cannon fighters with shrapnel cannon ints and when playing a gunship/tackler with singularity cannon I get demolished by shrapnel cannon ints, railgun fighters and mortar frigs at medium range and hail frigs at long range. These are direct hard counters to fighters that utilize that weapon and the reason why most people gave up on it. It makes you very vulnerable unless you’re exceptionally good with it and have a solid ECM/tackler screen around you.
Citing plasma gun as viable weapon for ints basically shows how little you understand about the game in the current state.
Sorry for nub questions / comments … I’m new to Guards, side effect of new progress system got me flying them now.
- Pre 0.9.0 - Guards led the frontlines … was that not it’s usual role?
- I mainly fly healer previously and attacking guardgineers were frowned upon etc etc and I received alot of comments saying if you wanted to attack or play frig up front, fly Guards. So what why the mixed info ?
- When inties had paper thin hulls (and they still do) - the logical approach is to send in the Guard first to tank the hits and inties swarm in and kill whoever is trying to kill your Guard or else. This does not apply now ?
No. That was only the case during the massive anomaly that was 0.8.x where guards were effectively immortal because of broken game mechanics. During 0.7.x screening close combat frigates with what became guard modules later were essentially fire support/area denial gunboats that needed support of lighter ships to function when they came to front lines and usually stayed some distance behind the front line to give them enough room to bring their guns to bear without need of turning. Front lines were always a place for fighters and interceptors because you need(ed) maneuverability and speed to get off the front lines when focused. This was made unnecessary by the broken gameplay mechanics of 0.8.x and effective frigate immortality that allowed them to operate on front lines. This was unintended and fixed in 0.9.0.
There is nothing wrong with being on the attack, as long as you understand that you are not the spearhead - you’re the shaft that comes after it. Your job is to let the interceptors and fighters make the push and provide heavy fire support to cover their backs while denying the area (beacon etc) to enemy fast response ships (typically ints).
The logical solution was to either snipe the ints from distance or send fighters/ints of your own to deal with them. Again, you’re thinking anomaly that was 0.8.x which enabled frigates to function in all roles due to effective immortality. During 0.7.x and before that situation was that every ship had a set of viable functions based on its strengths and weaknesses. We’re back to this model in 0.9.0. 0.8.x offered a model where two ship types had no real weaknesses and massive strengths, causing them to be optimal for almost all tasks in the game.
I eat singularity cannon fighters with shrapnel cannon ints and when playing a gunship/tackler with singularity cannont I get demolished by shrapnel cannon ints, railgun fighters and mortar frigs at medium range and hail frigs at long range. These are direct hard counters to fighters that utilize that weapon and the reason why most people gave up on it. It makes you very vulnerable unless you’re exceptionally good with it and have a solid ECM screen around you.
Citing plasma gun as viable weapon for ints basically shows how little you understand about the game in the current state.
I would reverse that statement actually, if anything I seem to know more about it then you.
The Shrapnel cannon is a joke currently due to it’s spread. You can’t hit anything with it at >700m. I thought the plasma gun was horrible before as well, then I actually started using it on my recon in T2 because shrapnel didn’t hit xxxx and pulse laser overheats before you can actually hit, but in T2 and even in T3 it is an awesome weapon. I will give it a try in T4 tomorrow/day after tomorrow on my inties and see how it does, but I expect it to excel there as well.
Could the plasma gun do with a damage boost? hell yes, but it is far better than the shrapnel in general engagements because you don’t have to be in pulsar range to actually hit.
And the .4 spread makes you able to hit just about anything with booster circuit.
And singularities can easily kill anything. He just needs to hit, which isn’t too hard in a lot of situations.
I eat singularity cannon fighters with shrapnel cannon ints and when playing a gunship/tackler with singularity cannon I get demolished by shrapnel cannon ints, railgun fighters and mortar frigs at medium range and hail frigs at long range. These are direct hard counters to fighters that utilize that weapon and the reason why most people gave up on it. It makes you very vulnerable unless you’re exceptionally good with it and have a solid ECM/tackler screen around you.
Citing plasma gun as viable weapon for ints basically shows how little you understand about the game in the current state.
Drop the elitism. No-one will like you for it.