Star Conflict OBT v. 0.9.0 Discussion

Mercenary Center Patch Discussion
1141

I would reverse that statement actually, if anything I seem to know more about it then you. 

 

The Shrapnel cannon is a joke currently due to it’s spread. You can’t hit anything with it at >700m. I thought the plasma gun was horrible before as well, then I actually started using it on my recon in T2 because shrapnel didn’t hit xxxx and pulse laser overheats before you can actually hit, but in T2 and even in T3 it is an awesome weapon. I will give it a try in T4 tomorrow/day after tomorrow  on my inties and see how it does, but I expect it to excel there as well.

Yes, that’s the point. The way to dismantle a fighter with singularity is to outturn him. That requires ranges of 400m or less. I just had that done to my R13 gunship by a R11 ECM in 1v1. Utterly helpless. He just outturns you and takes you down.

 

I just got totally destroyed in a standard game on my R13 gunship by a single shrapnel cannon ECM that got me when I was alone returning from a beacon drone strike in a game I played some 15 minutes ago. Than I did the same thing to the same player when he had to take his gunship after being taken down by someone when I was in my R11 ECM. Get close, outturn and kill. Easy because it’s a hard counter. The damage you will take won’t do more then dent your shields because even in best case scenario he’s firing half strength bubbles with only 2 side guns. When you do it right and stay behind and below, he’ll have to settle for quarter strength single gun bubbles that literally do nothing.

 

Considering that I have about 20 hours or so clocked at this point in T4/T5 PvP since the patch most of which was spent in fighters and ints, and the only times I recall seeing you there was in the rushing guard that tried to tank multiple gunships spamming damage on him at beacon by hiding behind the beacon 0.8.x style, I’d suggest a bit of humility. I’ll admit I have no clue how it currently goes at T3 as I haven’t played for more then a couple of games since the patch, so it may be different there. But you really don’t have the experience to talk about T4 right now, unless you were queue dodging me the entire weekend in T4/T5 PvP.

 

P.S. Calling shrapnel cannon a “joke” suggests that you never flew with RFR dogfight spec (not to be confused with easier to use but mediocre performance burst spec that was often flown by mediocre pilots) and do not know that you’re supposed to be in melee range with them. Having more then 500m between you and enemy doesn’t mean you don’t hit him - it means that he will consistently be able to hit you with two or even four gun shots. And your entire raison d’etre is in not getting shot by more then one, at most two guns of your target at any given time. It lets you outturn the enemy staying out of firing arcs of most of his guns while delivering devastating bursts of damage. Essentially this patch turned all interceptors into old school RFR dogfighter ints. And at T4/T5, we have plenty of those who know how to use those properly, and as a result, singularity is fairly rare in T4/T5 now. It’s simply countered too hard. Most people stick to railguns because they are much better against current ints.

1142

Drop the elitism. No-one will like you for it.

There is zero elitism there. In fact, I’m about middle ground at T4/T5 right now because I don’t have enough experience with some things that are needed at T4 such as feeling the flow of the game, which often gets me killed by being in a wrong place in at a right time. Unlike T3, in T4/T5 being in a wrong place in a right time means death. Also there are much better players out there who do better then I do with shrapnel cannon. And I certainly find it borderline OP in current implementation.

Also I don’t really treat forums as a popularity contest nor put that much thought in random strangers on internet “liking” me. That’s for facebook attention seekers. I’m here to discuss the gameplay the way I see it, and I tend to be a bit rough about it. This is because of my real life management style which I tend to take to games as well.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Management_by_perkele

1143

There is zero elitism there. In fact, I’m about middle ground at T4/T5 right now because I don’t have enough experience with some things that are needed at T4 such as feeling the flow of the game, which often gets me killed by being in a wrong place in at a right time. Unlike T3, in T4/T5 being in a wrong place in a right time means death. Also there are much better players out there who do better then I do with shrapnel cannon. And I certainly find it borderline OP in current implementation.

Also I don’t really treat forums as a popularity contest nor put that much thought in random strangers on internet “liking” me. That’s for facebook attention seekers. I’m here to discuss the gameplay the way I see it, and I tend to be a bit rough about it. This is because of my real life management style which I tend to take to games as well.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Management_by_perkele

I had a different wording that the administrators wouldn’t approve of me posting.

 

Ohh, yes there is. You constantly argue your own points as true and don’t give a crap about what other people say, or just wave them off when they’ve specifically proved you incorrect as inexperienced or naive to protect your image.

 

That’s elitism.

1144

I had a different wording that the administrators wouldn’t approve of me posting.

 

Ohh, yes there is. You constantly argue your own points as true and don’t give a crap about what other people say, or just wave them off when they’ve specifically proved you incorrect as inexperienced or naive to protect your image.

 

That’s elitism.

Funny, considering how I tend to get PMs from people I argue with on internet saying that they were surprised to see me turn 180 and agree when proven wrong. Perhaps you’re confusing being proven wrong with refusing to agree with points made by others that are not proven, lack logical basis or have a very weak and refutable logical basis while going against my experiences?

 

Elitism on the other hand has a very specific meaning: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elitism

I do not meet the requirements for a very simple reason: I will take an opinion of the lowest rated R1 pilot and agree if he can provide proof of his claims, or enough evidence of some sort to at least allow for reasonable doubt. To me it doesn’t matter WHO provides the evidence and logical arguments, as long as they are provided. That however is a requirement that few people can coherently do. Most just spew whatever they “feel is right” without any evidence or logical backing and then consider their case closed. A good example of this behavioral pattern are your initial claims of engineer tanking viability in old T2 and claims that based on your experiences with R4 ship, engineering frigates needed a survivability buff during 0.8.x patch.

 

If you have any desire to continue this particular line of discussion, please take it to PM.

1145

I just hope u are kidding. Speed an agility means NOTHING in a world dominated from guided missiles and area weapons. Plus u can dance as u want but if 5 people are shoothing on you probably some bullet hits the target. And as a cov op u die in 3 hits in t4/5.

Speed an agility lost worth with the patch.  There are still some interceptors who fly and loop to no end in 1v1.  Make it 2v2 or more players and the missiles and high damage weapons will take you out fast.  I’ve had a few deaths recently where even the kill log listed four people killing me.  I’m going to switch my Eagle-B out for my Ricasso, just for survivability.

 

Guard repairs are generally worthless. They are underused and under-appreciated, though, as they are a somewhat better version of the Shield Boosters. The regular boosters should be like these, expending energy over time for constant repairs. The repairs that really need fixing are the Engineer ones on Interceptors. They need to scale with ship size, not heal Ceptors in seconds. It’s like a terrible ad for some cheesy product: “HEALS YOUR CEPTORS FROM ZERO TO FULL IN 5 SECONDS OR BUST!!”

 

I definitely don’t like torpedoes, I got an EM torpedo to the face, yesterday. Godamnit, I didn’t even know what hit me. That thing literally 1-shot me from full to zero hp.

Then I’d like to see weapon damage scale with ship.  Let the shrapnel cannon do 9k damage to a frigate.  Then when you die in three seconds because an engineer wasn’t molesting you, you’ll know how it feels.

 

Best missiles to shutdown instantly LRF :smiley:

"                                                   " Command’s diffusion shield :smiley:

"                                                   " Random group of Ceptors :smiley: (i really love this in beacon hunt or domination) 

"                                                   " myself while Yelling “IF I DIE ! YOU DIE WITH ME”

 

 

 

Nothing good will happen

I like the “IF I DIE YOU DIE WITH ME” attitude.  I tried not to use it, but sometimes you just end up getting in a situation where running is suicide.  Don’t forget to ping, an assist is better than nothing.

 

Maybe I am wrong, if so call me on it.

 

But I find that the spread-nerf to Schrapnel Cannon was unwanted in that high number. 

I find myself unable to hit anything not 200m in front of me, and even then half of my shot misses. 

 

I say decrease spread by 25%, that should make it close range, but not melee range :slight_smile:

Give it the same mechanics as RFR.  Let early shots be exact and later shots be spread.  It encourages you to get closer to keep high damages.  Now you have to get close before you can start dealing higher damages.  I can hit people, but considering most of the new weapons are 1k dps, it ends up looking like 200 dps for the interceptor’s weapons spread.

1146

I think the problem, if you can call it a problem, is that most interceptor pilots don’t understand what they are flying. Interceptors are skirmishers; they scout, harass and support, but NEVER engage. Not directly, at any rate. I’m still having a lot of success with my interceptors (in T2 and T3) because I try to fly by one simple rule; fair is for Fighters and Frigates.

The interceptors should be kiting around the battlefield looking for isolated, vulnerable and (ideally) already engaged opponents. When confronted, they should flee to the safety of their bigger ships, using Engineers to restore any damage and letting the mass Commands and Tacklers chase off whoever attacked them.

The days of the ace pilot are fading. Star Conflict is increasingly reflecting real world aerial warfare, where the skill of the unit trumps the individual.

There is nothing, NOTHING wrong with the current missile spam. The problem is pilots (especially CovOp pilots) have gotten used to being able to tie up 4+ opponents indefinitely. Those days are over, and good riddance. Pilots like me, who focus on supporting allies and punishing enemy mistakes still make a killing. I don’t want to see us go back to the old ways.

Frigate Balls are dying. Inty spam is dying. Fighters now rule supreme, and as the last Recon standing I couldn’t be happier.

1147

ive it the same mechanics as RFR.  Let early shots be exact and later shots be spread.  It encourages you to get closer to keep high damages.  Now you have to get close before you can start dealing higher damages.  I can hit people, but considering most of the new weapons are 1k dps, it ends up looking like 200 dps for the interceptor’s weapons spread.

It has largely the same mechanic in terms of spread. Initial spread on my R11 jericho ECM is 1.5deg. It’s manageable. Just need to have patience to wait for the reticule to shrink back to 1.5deg before firing again. Most people lack the firing discipline and just hold the button down, resulting in hilarious max spread that indeed hits nothing unless at 100m or so. I do that against some frigs, because it gives max dps against target big enough to be hit with it.

 

I’d really like for it to get the charge accumulation also, but that would be OP without damage nerf as it would allow strafe alpha strike runs. With new damage values these would one shot fighters that already lost shields and cause massive damage even to frigs.

1148

I think the problem, if you can call it a problem, is that most interceptor pilots don’t understand what they are flying. Interceptors are skirmishers; they scout, harass and support, but NEVER engage. Not directly, at any rate. I’m still having a lot of success with my interceptors (in T2 and T3) because I try to fly by one simple rule; fair is for Fighters and Frigates.

The interceptors should be kiting around the battlefield looking for isolated, vulnerable and (ideally) already engaged opponents. When confronted, they should flee to the safety of their bigger ships, using Engineers to restore any damage and letting the mass Commands and Tacklers chase off whoever attacked them.

The days of the ace pilot are fading. Star Conflict is increasingly reflecting real world aerial warfare, where the skill of the unit trumps the individual.

There is nothing, NOTHING wrong with the current missile spam. The problem is pilots (especially CovOp pilots) have gotten used to being able to tie up 4+ opponents indefinitely. Those days are over, and good riddance. Pilots like me, who focus on supporting allies and punishing enemy mistakes still make a killing. I don’t want to see us go back to the old ways.

Frigate Balls are dying. Inty spam is dying. Fighters now rule supreme, and as the last Recon standing I couldn’t be happier.

It’s worth noting that ace ints still exist. But they now need to actually pick their fights and disengage when focused. Gone are the days when you could slaughter people while focused just because you had flying skill. And to that I agree, good riddance. If 3-4 people lock onto you when you’re engaging someone and you can stay engaged, that is arguably OP.

 

P.S. <3 recon. :salute:

1149

I just got totally destroyed in a standard game on my R13 gunship by a single shrapnel cannon ECM that got me when I was alone returning from a beacon drone strike in a game I played some 15 minutes ago. Than I did the same thing to the same player when he had to take his gunship after being taken down by someone when I was in my R11 ECM. Get close, outturn and kill. Easy because it’s a hard counter. The damage you will take won’t do more then dent your shields because even in best case scenario he’s firing half strength bubbles with only 2 side guns. When you do it right and stay behind and below, he’ll have to settle for quarter strength single gun bubbles that literally do nothing.

 

Considering that I have about 20 hours or so clocked at this point in T4/T5 PvP since the patch most of which was spent in fighters and ints, and the only times I recall seeing you there was in the rushing guard that tried to tank multiple gunships spamming damage on him at beacon by hiding behind the beacon 0.8.x style, I’d suggest a bit of humility. I’ll admit I have no clue how it currently goes at T3 as I haven’t played for more then a couple of games since the patch, so it may be different there. But you really don’t have the experience to talk about T4 right now, unless you were queue dodging me the entire weekend in T4/T5 PvP.

 

P.S. Calling shrapnel cannon a “joke” suggests that you never flew with RFR dogfight spec (not to be confused with easier to use but mediocre performance burst spec that was often flown by mediocre pilots) and do not know that you’re supposed to be in melee range with them. Having more then 500m between you and enemy doesn’t mean you don’t hit him - it means that he will consistently be able to hit you with two or even four gun shots. And your entire raison d’etre is in not getting shot by more then one, at most two guns of your target at any given time. It lets you outturn the enemy staying out of firing arcs of most of his guns while delivering devastating bursts of damage. Essentially this patch turned all interceptors into old school RFR dogfighter ints. And at T4/T5, we have plenty of those who know how to use those properly, and as a result, singularity is fairly rare in T4/T5 now. It’s simply countered too hard. Most people stick to railguns because they are much better against current ints.

I really should just cut you off here, and stop responding… But for the sake of having nothing else to read on the forum anymore, I’ll bite.

I was farming synergy in T2/T3, and will soon return to T4/T5. Because yes I will go down a few tiers to get me some new ships.

 

 

And I think I have over 50 hours already in T4/T5 matches, in T3 inties, and T4 fighters/engineers. And the guard-suicide was to farm synergy as well,  since geting kills works wonders for synergy. And I mostly died due to singularities…Which everyone died to funnily enough…

 

And I did fly the SC like that, but it still did not feel that good to me, and I prefer to hit from some range with accuracy, so plasma gun is perfect for me. I won’t say it may be the wrong gun for you, but for me it is. On the Kris AE, with a build-in 33% spread reduction it worked wonderfully(combined with CPU-modifier spread reduce) but without the ship-boost it doesn’t work for me.

1150

I think the problem, if you can call it a problem, is that most interceptor pilots don’t understand what they are flying. Interceptors are skirmishers; they scout, harass and support, but NEVER engage. Not directly, at any rate. I’m still having a lot of success with my interceptors (in T2 and T3) because I try to fly by one simple rule; fair is for Fighters and Frigates.

The interceptors should be kiting around the battlefield looking for isolated, vulnerable and (ideally) already engaged opponents. When confronted, they should flee to the safety of their bigger ships, using Engineers to restore any damage and letting the mass Commands and Tacklers chase off whoever attacked them.

The days of the ace pilot are fading. Star Conflict is increasingly reflecting real world aerial warfare, where the skill of the unit trumps the individual.

There is nothing, NOTHING wrong with the current missile spam. The problem is pilots (especially CovOp pilots) have gotten used to being able to tie up 4+ opponents indefinitely. Those days are over, and good riddance. Pilots like me, who focus on supporting allies and punishing enemy mistakes still make a killing. I don’t want to see us go back to the old ways.

Frigate Balls are dying. Inty spam is dying. Fighters now rule supreme, and as the last Recon standing I couldn’t be happier.

 

Basically what you are saying is : “Now is better becouse skill worth less”. Offcourse i totally disagree.

 

 

 

And anyway even in the scenario u prospected “kiting around the battlefield looking for isolated, vulnerable and (ideally) already engaged opponents” there is a serious iusse with cov ops: if somene see u, you find yourself at 30% hull in 2 hit… before u can even react.

Than u react… try to move anway leaving the target u was fighting… but is there when a guided missiles come. And u are done.

If u have Camo ready you can maybe survive… but in the end what u just did? Had some shoots on a ship before u had to run fast becouse eomene else engaed u. Basically u just didn’t anything usefull for your team… becouse u are an usless ship.

 

Cov Ops need lot more damage output (u should be able to 3~4 shot everything but guards) or remarkable more survivability to be usefull and flyeable with the new post 9.0 “rules”.

1151

Is it just me or this game gets worse with every patch. I mean each patch goes 1 step forward and 4 steps back. I had much more fun in the older version thats for sure.

1152

AlexD, first time I flew my (T2) covops under the current patch I got something like 7 kills and 4 assists. Three of those were a Jericho LR who wouldn’t take a hint.

By using terrain and reading the flow of battle I was able to fly into the enemy spawn, frag the frigate and get out again.

They do not need to be more powerful. They need intelligent pilots who pick their fights. People have gotten too used to the idea of covops doing all the heavy lifting in this game, and I honestly don’t think it was ever meant to be that way.

1153

After about 10 matches today:

Is there any barrier between T4 and T5?

We were mostly flying T5 with a squadmate who had a rank 15 ship.

On the enemy team we had the full spectrum of t4s and t5s. How did a poor guy with only an Anaconda MK II got matched vs. us (btw. we won 8/10 matches so no loosing streak “bonus”)?

So, i have to conclude: In terms of matchmaking T4 = T5.

1154

I would suspect the number of people queueing for T5 isn’t particularly high, so the MM system is filling in the gaps with T4 pilots. (Not that T4 is huge to begin with)

 

Did you have the queue-graph on to see what the spread of queued pilots was?

 

/set cl_showMmQueueInfo 2
1155

yea, I use the queue graph. 

It seems like he fills all t4s and t5s in one queue. It doesnt seem to matter if there are 4 other t5s so that we could do a 4v4, no it just fills all of them in one queue, like bigger is better. 

On the other hand if i´m alone in T3 for about 5 mins (yea this happens from time to time) I didnt get matched vs T2s. 

At last not without having a very long loosing-streak. 

1156

In your case the MM system should be more likely to put you in T4 in such a situation. Unless the MM system understands what your nickname stands for, then it might throw you into T1 instead. :wink:

 

 

[Zapp Brannigan has just piloted the Titanic straight into the path of a black hole] 

Captain Zapp Brannigan: Don’t blame yourself, Kif. We were doomed from the start. I guess all that remains now is for the captain to go down with the ship. 

Lt. Kif Kroker: That’s surprisingly noble of you, sir. 

Captain Zapp Brannigan: No, it’s noble of you, Kif. As of now, you’re in command. Congratulations, Captain. 

[Zapp runs off] 

1157

Wouldn’t be Zap if he didn’t do that.

1158

Well, does that depend on if Im flying solo or in a squad (they might pull me higher) ?

Fighting T1s with T5s…  :Dwop

 

 

 

KIF KROKER:
Shall I initiate a pointless and potentially fatal pursuit?

ZAPP BRANNIGAN:
Make it so!

 

Zapp Brannigan: “Fire all weapons and set a transmission frequency for my victory yodel.” 

 

 

On a side note: I do hope you all have the Zappers voice in your heads while reading my posts  :taunt:

1159

I guess we will get more accurate data once more people fly in T4/T5. A fair few people are flocking towards those upper tiers, so it’s just a matter of time.
 

 

Zapp Brannigan: We’ll just set a new course for that empty region over there, near that blackish, holeish thing.
Zapp Brannigan: Captain’s log: We have lost control of the ship. Adddendum: Whoooaaaa!

1160

I think the problem, if you can call it a problem, is that most interceptor pilots don’t understand what they are flying…; fair is for Fighters and Frigates.

The days of the ace pilot are fading. Star Conflict is increasingly reflecting real world aerial warfare, where the skill of the unit trumps the individual.

There is nothing, NOTHING wrong with the current missile spam. The problem is pilots have gotten used to being able to tie up 4+ opponents indefinitely. Those days are over… I don’t want to see us go back to the old ways.

 

Worth quoting.

 

It’s worth noting that ace ints still exist. But they now need to actually pick their fights and disengage when focused. Gone are the days when you could slaughter people while focused just because you had flying skill. And to that I agree, good riddance. If 3-4 people lock onto you when you’re engaging someone and you can stay engaged, that is arguably OP.

 

Worth quoting especially considering it’s coming from an Interceptor pilot.

 

But no, being able to ignore 6+ lockons and continue to kill multiple target does not need arguing. IT IS OP :slight_smile:

 

 

 

Basically what you are saying is : “Now is better becouse skill worth less”. Offcourse i totally disagree.

 

Wrong.

Basically what we’re saying is that Intelligence, Timing and Teamwork is worth more now. Ofcourse you totally missed the point.

 

 

** There are certain Interceptor pilots still flying around like they used to and scoring multi-kills everywhere even after this patch ** but they’ve always been exceptionally good at what they do, so it’s not the case where skill has been taken out of interceptor play. It’s just the minimum level of skill required to do it has been raised ** If you don’t meet the new minimum, learn to teamwork.