Star Conflict OBT v. 0.9.0 Discussion

Mercenary Center Patch Discussion
901

Not when the fire rate is less than one.  It may be 2k DPS, but it’s 2.5k per hit.  At point blank range, they’re dieing.  A lucky shot on an interceptor and two thirds of it’s shields are gone.  That huge resistance you’re talking about, 15 points out of 2.5k.  The point based resists are useless compared to percents with the new damages.

The real issue is that ints can’t generally afford resists, as they need other mods. As a result you end up hitting negative EM resists on int’s shields, effectively demolishing them. Game’s damage system seems to work in a way where when damage to shields is greater than amount of shiedls, the overflowing amount is transferred to hull ignoring the hull’s resists, and using shield’s resists instead.

Or at least it seems that way from numbers I’m seeing on ints. I could be wrong on this.

902

While ECM is probably OP at the moment, the real nasties are the fighters. All three of them. Singularity gun in good hands is exceptionally powerful.

I recommend practicing in PvE. I can now hit stuff without even locking it with it at reasonable distances. It’s a bit like bowling in space.

I’m serious.

 

Considering the damages from fighters and frigates, I don’t think any interceptor’s OP.  By the time you start getting hit and try to veer away, you might be dead.

 

But PvE’s a breeze now!

903

I’ll just post this here for reference about “overpowered, overgeared, immortal ESB”.

 

dx0v.jpg

czxa.jpg

oxud.jpg

 

My two squad mates weren’t even on TS, and one of them had to semi afk at times. There you go folks - want to do T4? Apply to NASA!

 

http://www.fgjmusic.net/nasa/phpbb3/viewtopic.php?f=15&t=13

And yes, that is Castor. The R11 gunship. With greens and whites.

u9a2.jpg

P.S. This post is dedicated to Mikelius1 and TaylorSwift. You guys were awesome.

 

Oh stop, you! :Dwop

904

I’ll just post this here for reference about “overpowered, overgeared, immortal ESB”.

And yes, that is Castor. The R11 gunship. With greens and whites.

 

So lemme get this straight… You’re complaining about the fact that ESB is bringing 4 full blue T5 ships when you have your own R15 ship slotted in and everyone else having T3/4’s, as well?..

905

So lemme get this straight… You’re complaining about the fact that ESB is bringing 4 full blue T5 ships when you have your own R15 ship slotted in and everyone else having T3/4’s, as well?..

You didn’t notice what I’m flying, did you? Hangar matters more than what is in the field?

 

Also, I’m complaining? Did you read the post at all?

906

http://www.picshare.ru/view/2644136/’> HU1PBtS56L.gif

Evil Space Pandas!

907

You didn’t notice what I’m flying, did you? Hangar matters more than what is in the field?

 

Also, I’m complaining? Did you read the post at all?

Yes, it does matter what you have in the hangar. More specifically, it matters what you bring into battle. If you have T5 ships, you’ll be pitted into T5 battles. I thought you knew this… I’m disappointed in you.

 

 

Evil Space Pandas!

http://l-userpic.livejournal.com/95488253/6094427

908

Yes, it does matter what you have in the hangar. More specifically, it matters what you bring into battle. If you have T5 ships, you’ll be pitted into T5 battles. I thought you knew this… I’m disappointed in you.

 

 

http://l-userpic.livejournal.com/95488253/6094427

Actually it doesn’t in highest queues at the moment. T4 and T5 are in the same queue. And as you can see, in good hands T4 can demolish T5 easily, even when T5 pilots are good.

 

Which was the whole point, addressing the “omg blue/purple ESB rapezored me because they haz gearz and rankz” whine.

909

Luckyo, too bad usual teams are terrible huh.

910

Also try fighting them in a 4 v4, good try with that…they will just steamroll you with epic naga reps.

911

Luckyo, too bad usual teams are terrible huh.

In all the honesty, it depends. We had a really good few hours tonight, teams were decent on both sides. It went either way too, and ESB didn’t dominate, because 4 man team has little chance of dominating in 12v12.

 

The games of suck are 4v4/5v5 where one side gets a full ESB squad and other gets full randoms. That is just painful farm with no hope of real gameplay. That’s why I’m advocating a longer queue for squads if there is no other squad to put on other side until they are allowed into “random” queue, to give them motivation to split into two two man squads that can end on opposite sides instead of grinding with four on one side. But that is unlikely to happen.

912

Covert ops totally didn’t deserve that nerf.  ECM’s stasis and recons shield vamp now outclass orion so much that its not worth using.

 

Wth have you been smoking? Covert Ops are op as xxxx as they are right now, stupid damage is stupid.

913

Also bring back Realistic, this Arcade bullshlt is so fckin stupid…

914

Actually it doesn’t in highest queues at the moment. T4 and T5 are in the same queue. And as you can see, in good hands T4 can demolish T5 easily, even when T5 pilots are good.

 

Which was the whole point, addressing the “omg blue/purple ESB rapezored me because they haz gearz and rankz” whine.

Well, to be fair, there isn’t any module/slot difference between T4 and T5… but claiming people to be “good” when they put on such a bad show… No.

915

You can run standard in your own custom game room all day if you want. You even get rewards so long as you use standard rules.

 

As for covert ops, I flew about 90% of my games in them ever since they came out, in spite of them being massively underpowered throughout 0.8.x frigate conflict.

 

Ever since 0.9.0 came out, I all but stopped flying it, even prior to the latest nerfs. It’s simply gimp. ECM does everything CO does, only better. And if you want to do heavy damage, there are two ships available: sniper frigate and gunship. No interceptor is a primary damage dealer any more, though ECM can sorta kinda be one. Rest just do not have survivability to be able to inflict any damage.

 

And I migrated to being mainly a fighter pilot who dabbles into inty flying when needed from inty pilot who dabbled in fighters and frigs until ints get a survivability buff.

916

Well, to be fair, there isn’t any module/slot difference between T4 and T5… but claiming people to be “good” when they put on such a bad show… No.

Difference between T4 and T5 is greater than any other tier, because of massively overpowered R13 and R14 implants. You get crap like gunships with constant overdrive and aiming overcharge, guard frigs with permanent pulsar and shield regen module and so on. Ability to cloak out or wipe all debuffs when losing shield is a massive survivability buff as well.

 

And mind you all good players have not so good games. Including myself. You delude yourself if you think that good players are always going to put up an impressive performance. And in many cases, it’s the pressure from the opposing side that can prevent this “impressive performance” as has happened in those two games.

 

Essentially, no matter how good you are, no matter how much better tools you are given, there is a chance of outplaying the opposition. If people spent even a fraction of energy spent on whining on actually improving their own play skills, ESB wouldn’t be even half as dominant as it is today.

917

Difference between T4 and T5 is greater than any other tier, because of massively overpowered R13 and R14 implants. You get crap like gunships with constant overdrive and aiming overcharge, guard frigs with permanent pulsar and shield regen module and so on. Ability to cloak out or wipe all debuffs when losing shield is a massive survivability buff as well.

Ohwow, that is pretty damn terrible… xxxx sad, really.

918

Ohwow, that is pretty damn terrible… xxxx sad, really.

But the point stands - I was flying a R11 ship with mix of mk2, mk3 and military gear without any of those implants. They were flying R13 and better ships. All they needed to do was kill me. And they failed, terribly.

 

Because you can always outplay the opposition. Or die trying. And in big 12v12 games even trying tends to be rewarding, even if you fail miserably. And when you succeed even though odds are stacked against you, it only feels better.

 

My message to most people complaining about ESB at T4 is this: unless it’s quiet time when you actually have to play 4v4/5v5 games against them, stop crying and try again. They do not dominate bigger games, simply because they cannot. Four people cannot stop twelve in this game, even if twelve are undergeared and worse players. But they can outplay them. And that’s where skill, rather than gear or ranks comes into play. And most of ESB squads are nothing if not predictable - something you will likely come to realize once you play enough games with and against them, as I did.

919

But the point stands - I was flying a R11 ship with mix of mk2, mk3 and military gear without any of those implants. They were flying R13 and better ships. All they needed to do was kill me. And they failed, terribly.

 

in terms of the sheer amount of games played in total vs one, your result is statistically insignificant.

 

here’s some stats tho: the performance difference between T1/T2 and T2/T3 is about 20-25%. not counting implants. if you add plants you can bump that to 25-33% performance difference. this include base stats, mods and implants.

 

as i’ve said before, that needs to be reduced to about 15%, which would be quite insignificant. by 25-33% is too much. it’s basically like 12v15 or 12v16… in terms of numbers… assuming you had a T2 vs all T1 team, which has happened to me on several occassions… but still, a 33% unit performance difference is just… overboard… not as bad a WoT tho… but almost… WoT = 40% dps and armor difference per tier… with 3-tier spread = 80% difference…

 

in fact, i’m probably underestimating as there are some implants which give huge bonuses… so the performance difference between tiers probably is about 40%, modelelled on WoT… good game…

 

in fact, the whole WoT model is built to push player up the tiers, forcing them to spend more as the grind increases, and since premium items of higher tiers cost more… a lot more… the reason for the 3-tier spread: i can’t believe that over 80% of the T-4/5 games i was in had T-6/7s… can’t even pen their armor, unless you buy premium ammo… it’s a no-win situation. even if you hit their weak point… nothing… not a scratch…

 

it’s not quite that bad since only a 2-tier spread in this game… bu 33-40% performance difference is a bit much… add on top of that the huge difference in performance between ship classes… and it’s a recipe for imbalance soup…

 

every single imbalance can basically stack… the unit class imbalances, on top of the tier imbalances… on top of weapons… what you end up with are abusable mechanics…

 

specialization and roles are fine, as long as they’re not too well-defined… if they are too strict you just end up with no-win situations… and no player likes those, especially since they can abused in conjunction with other imbalances that exist…

 

now take the largest imabalnce you can find and apply it to a whole fleet… it gets even worse…

 

the whole point in balancing is to iron out the differences, not make them more pronounced…

 

now getting back to the 0.90 update #2:

 

Projectile speed for all weapons now depends on the technological level:

* OnT1 speed is reduced by 10%

* On T2 speed remains unchanged

* On T3 speed is increased by 10%

* On T4 speed is increased by 20%

* On T5 speed is increased by 30%

 

this requires some serious facepalming…

 

more imbalances that i spoke of… the difference is def 40% between tiers now, since i forgot to add this into account.

 

now let’s apply some of the previous rules in multiplicative fashion:

 

let’s just say an assault has a 30% advantage over a command, as long as they can land their shots. and say the assult is 1 tier higher.

 

1.3x1.4=1.82… that unit now has a 80% advantage… oops… now stack some weapon imbalances on that… you could say he could end up with a 100% advantage… maybe a few percent more for experimental mods/premium ship, GS costs basically…

 

now start stacking such imbalances on entire fleets and you can easily see how this problem can get out of control.

 

message falls on deaf ears _ sound of crickets in the background

920

http://youtu.be/OkOsQh8OZa0

 

so there’s some words of wisdom from GITS for you.

 

regarding: weapon selection and balance issues.