Star Conflict OBT v. 0.9.0 Discussion

Mercenary Center Patch Discussion
841

no, specialization is what you call IMBALANCE.

 

to quote GITS - “overspecialize and you breed in weakness”.

 

it is good to an extent. but when unit performance between classes is so drastic that there are no-win situations… it’s anything but balance.

 

every unit should stand at least some percent of a chance vs another unit. anything else is just paper-scissors-rock… if you like that type of stuff.

 

and quite honestly, until you balance out the individual units, you have no hope of ever balancing fleet engagements.

This is something I have to agree with betatrash.

842

I’ve played hundreds of matches with my Desert Eagle, Nukem, Bear, Parallax and Dragonfly, which means I’m now screwed because I didn’t spend that time flying the Prometheus, Phobos, Katana, etc. 

 

thanks

843

critics on russian side of the forums come around and say that they are liking the game and the “butthurt is over” (actual direct quote) in the last day. I suspect the same will happen here with a bit more of a delay.

 

And I’m finally R15 with fed. God awful grind, and as I expected

 

#1: whenever you hear someone use the term ‘butthurt’ you can assume they are a troll. guaranteed.

 

#2: there’s a bit of a contradiction in your later statement. in that, you’re already R15, so what would you care? ;\ this is exactly the point i brought up with one of the mods: the only people who seem not to care any more are those who already have the T4s and T5s they want.

 

Devs stated on the russian forums that the reason for the change was that some of the ships, such as R7, R10 etc ships weren’t getting flown, and they want to see all ships in game being actively used.

 

what they actually mean is they want everyone to BUY every ship in the game… anyways, the last time i heard this, a certain company release a 100$ ‘gold’ pack, then promptly abandoned their userbase and the game never saw a single update/bugfix after that…

844

#1: whenever you hear someone use the term ‘butthurt’ you can assume they are a troll. guaranteed.

 

#2: there’s a bit of a contradiction in your later statement. in that, you’re already R15, so what would you care? ;\ this is exactly the point i brought up with one of the mods: the only people who seem not to care any more are those who already have the T4s and T5s they want.

 

 

what they actually mean is they want everyone to BUY every ship in the game… anyways, the last time i heard this, a certain company release a 100$ ‘gold’ pack, then promptly abandoned their userbase and the game never saw a single update/bugfix after that…

#1. Actually no, but if you choose to paint everyone with the same brush, it’s your funeral.

#2 I’m R15 in one ship line. There are NINE ship lines in total. Unlike many I actually actively play multiple roles. Unlike almost all of folks on this forum I now know exactly how much grind there is ahead of me. I’m far better informed than essentially everyone on this forum barring a few others like me about the amount of grind and the impact it will make on my game. I’m currently starting on me second ship type grind and cursing myself for not buying out more ships when it just cost money. I’d have a lot less grind ahead of me if I did.

 

You on the other hand show your utter cluelessness on the subject with these absurd accusations.

 

#3. To reinforce my point about your cluelessness, your last point existed prior to this patch, ever since roles got introduced in 0.8.0 in fact. The patch that many currently put on pedestal and are worshipping as some sort of perfection that game should be rolled back to. Back then, to progress in any ship tree, you had to buy all ships. Just like you have now. This has not changed.

The only difference is that you also have to actually play the ships as well, instead of just spending money on each ship line.

 

In fact, the new ship line continuations in T5 are far better then those of lower tiers, and they are clearly split into single class and primary class/secondary class for each race, so that you do not have to level different classes to progress once you hit high enough level in respective tree. I only wish the rest of the trees looked as clean as T5 does.

 

P.S. The saddest part is that last point was already made to you just a few hours ago and you agreed that you were in the wrong - only to regurgitate the same, already refuted arguments here.

[http://forum.star-conflict.com/index.php?/topic/20628-star-conflict-obt-v-090-discussion/?view=findpost&p=213427](< base_url >/index.php?/topic/20628-star-conflict-obt-v-090-discussion/?view=findpost&p=213427)

845

#1. Actually no, but if you choose to paint everyone with the same brush, it’s your funeral.

 

i stand by my original assesment, in that i’ve yet to hear an intelligent individual use the term ‘butthurt’…

 

#2 I’m R15 in one ship line. There are NINE ship lines in total. blahblahsomethingsomething…

 

You on the other hand show your utter cluelessness on the subject with these absurd accusations.

 

what accusations? i think you’re taking it a bit overboard. you said you had a T5… its a fact maybe, not an accusation…

 

#3. To reinforce my point about your cluelessness, your last point existed prior to this patch, ever since roles got introduced in 0.8.0 in fact. The patch that many currently put on pedestal and are worshipping as some sort of perfection that game should be rolled back to. Back then, to progress in any ship tree, you had to buy all ships. Just like you have now. This has not changed.

The only difference is that you also have to actually play the ships as well, instead of just spending money on each ship line.

 

P.S. The saddest part is that last point was already made to you just a few hours ago and you agreed that you were in the wrong - only to regurgitate the same, already refuted arguments here.

[http://forum.star-conflict.com/index.php?/topic/20628-star-conflict-obt-v-090-discussion/?view=findpost&p=213427](< base_url >/index.php?/topic/20628-star-conflict-obt-v-090-discussion/?view=findpost&p=213427)

 

no, what i in fact meant was they want your to buy the higher tier premium ships… should have been more clear. it’s why i mentioned this other game with the 100$ pack… they absolutely want to push players into higher tiers to sell them premiums… whenever you hear the term ‘we want players to use all the items’ it means ‘we want players to buy them all’ basically… like that 100$ pack aka everything pack in this other game…

 

and in fact, the link you posted is my using reverse psychology on xKostyan to make him prove my point for me, which that post does quite clearly…

 

i think it’s safe to say that you have effectively proven yourself to be a non-effective troll… i also think you need to relax… you sound a bit… frustrated…

846

Guys, tone it down. Going back and forth won’t fix anything. 

847

so many new guys joining in on months old balance discussion commenting on things that actually got fixed asking it to be unfixed again. why tone it down? so much fun. wished they came on months back when we were actually talking about them. guess better late and uninformed than never?

848

Devs stated on the russian forums that the reason for the change was that some of the ships, such as R7, R10 etc ships weren’t getting flown, and they want to see all ships in game being actively used.

 

Annoying but that’s how they want it and it’s their game.

 

I believe I mentioned somewhere on the forums about the possible benefits of flying a slightly lower-ranked ship in the tier. I fly mainly tacklers and frigates, so offhand I can only recall the passive bonuses of those ships in 0.8.

 

Fox vs. Fox-M: Despite the Fox-M’s higher rank, I think we can all safely conclude that the Fox-M’s passive bonus is crap. Energy usage reduction? I never had any problems with energy. In fact, ECMs are the only reason why my energy level would go below 50%. Now, the Fox is a different story. 50% boost to module parameters? That’s actually a pretty nice boost. But is it enough to cover the loss of an active module slot, some passive mods and ship modifiers, and two implants? Maybe not quite.

 

The Neuron Zealot and the Crus-Q is a somewhat similar example. The Crus-Q has an extra implant that boosts damage (not that significant, perhaps) and a shield modifier (very important for a guard). But for a ship that slow, the Neuron Zealot’s range bonus on guard modules do help quite a lot. 

 

If the devs want us to fly some ships, then they should give us some incentive to, not force us to fly them. At this rate, I’ll rather stay stagnant at T2. 

849

Devs stated on the russian forums that the reason for the change was that some of the ships, such as R7, R10 etc ships weren’t getting flown, and they want to see all ships in game being actively used.

 

Annoying but that’s how they want it and it’s their game.

That is the most stupid response I’ve ever read.

You can’tmake people fly crappy ships by forcing them, well obviously you can, but that is the most stupid thing I’ve ever heard.

When you got crappy ships that are never getting flown the problem is with the game and you don’t fix that by increasing the grind by a 1000, you fix that by fixing the goddamn ships!

 

They should take a look at EVE online and how they fix their issues, they had ships that weren’t getting flown, and they fixed the whole goddamn shiptree so every ship was worth it to fly.

850

Devs stated on the russian forums that the reason for the change was that some of the ships, such as R7, R10 etc ships weren’t getting flown, and they want to see all ships in game being actively used.

 

Annoying but that’s how they want it and it’s their game.

Make us want to fly the ships. Don’t force it on anyone. Make every ship within a tier equal relative power, and let each ship have different quirks that separates them from each other. Have one queue per tier. MM solved. People will want to buy more than one ship if the ships are worth keeping. Gotta catch’em all and all that. Premium ships can have unique quirks, unique models as well as perks that increases rewards when used in battle to make them desirable on multiple fronts. The game is beautiful, it’ll sell itself if you just step away from this staircase mentality and try to make a balanced game that you’ll want to come back to! Just look at LoL and other arena games and you’ll see a staircase is not required to make sales.

851

So let me get this straight, people weren’t flying ships they didn’t like, so the devs are trying to force people to fly ships they don’t like?  I don’t really fly frigates, but I’ve upgraded the line to have it available if I wanted one.  Right now the fighter and interceptor lines are mixed together.  If you try to go straight fighter, you’re forced to play interceptor!  For Jericho that means playing ECM and CO until full synergy to upgrade to a R6 fighter.  An R6 fighter for the feds mean being an engineer and guard to full synergy.  Empire needs recon and ECM to get to the command fighter.  At least a fed frigate can outrun a fighter of other factions.  How many posts have we seen of ship lag with interceptors which makes the ships hard to play because of network conditions?

 

The only lines not overly screwed up by synergy are the frigate lines!

852

So let me get this straight, people weren’t flying ships they didn’t like, so the devs are trying to force people to fly ships they don’t like?  I don’t really fly frigates, but I’ve upgraded the line to have it available if I wanted one.  Right now the fighter and interceptor lines are mixed together.  If you try to go straight fighter, you’re forced to play interceptor!  For Jericho that means playing ECM and CO until full synergy to upgrade to a R6 fighter.  An R6 fighter for the feds mean being an engineer and guard to full synergy.  Empire needs recon and ECM to get to the command fighter.  At least a fed frigate can outrun a fighter of other factions.  How many posts have we seen of ship lag with interceptors which makes the ships hard to play because of network conditions?

 

The only lines not overly screwed up by synergy are the frigate lines!

 

I believe you only need to have enough synergy on one of the pre-requisite ships, not both.

853

You only need a single line of progression, not all of them.

 

However, a much more valid example is seen in the Empire. Say you want to fly a Styx, because the Styx is frankly awesome. Here’s what you have to grind:

 

Hercules [Gunship] (to unknown synergy - not a big issue as it’s the start ship).

Harpy [LR] to Synergy 4.

Iron Harpy [LR] to unknown synergy (probably 6).

Steel Harpy [LR] to unknown synergy (probably 6).

 

You then have to not take the Hydra 2 [Engineer] at Rank 6 and take the Hydra [LR] instead.

 

Then you fly the Acid Hydra [LR], the Cerberus [LR] and finally you’re allowed to fly the Styx.

 

One Gunship and Seven Long Range Frigates to unlock the Rank 9 Engineer for the Empire… having been forced to skip their Rank 6 Engineer along the way.

 

Crazy…

854

Yes it’s one of them, not the two ships.

855

Me personly realy dislike the synergy and how its com to much WOT, grind fest.

Im kinda angry i spent the mony for the DLC wen i see how the game becoming.

And this xxxx with the color ship and the stickers suxs big time, if u buy em with real mony u get em permant on ur ship not 7 or 30 days it’s so wrong.

The new wepon system kinda wierd and boring, only gun i find any cool is Motar.

And u add synergy bonus now to get more pepol grind this crap.

 

I just regged this forum after this patch just to tell u its suxs.

 

Sry my bad english.

856

Fox vs. Fox-M: Despite the Fox-M’s higher rank, I think we can all safely conclude that the Fox-M’s passive bonus is crap. Energy usage reduction? I never had any problems with energy. In fact, ECMs are the only reason why my energy level would go below 50%. Now, the Fox is a different story. 50% boost to module parameters? That’s actually a pretty nice boost. But is it enough to cover the loss of an active module slot, some passive mods and ship modifiers, and two implants? Maybe not quite.

 

The Neuron Zealot and the Crus-Q is a somewhat similar example. The Crus-Q has an extra implant that boosts damage (not that significant, perhaps) and a shield modifier (very important for a guard). But for a ship that slow, the Neuron Zealot’s range bonus on guard modules do help quite a lot. 

 

If the devs want us to fly some ships, then they should give us some incentive to, not force us to fly them. At this rate, I’ll rather stay stagnant at T2. 

Their theme with the ship bonuses is that one faction gets the better lower tier bonuses while another one gets them in higher tiers. So e.g. Jericho has the best T2 commands and guards but you’ll want empire commands and federation guards in T5 that you have to grind to using different ship types.

It’s a pretty messed up progression. My guess is they want you to have to fly as many ships you do not want to fly as possible to increase the pressure to transfer synergy and just skip them.

How they’ll end up dealing with the problem that quite a few players just stay in T2 by choice because of that remains to be seen.

857

You only need a single line of progression, not all of them.

 

However, a much more valid example is seen in the Empire. Say you want to fly a Styx, because the Styx is frankly awesome. Here’s what you have to grind:

 

Hercules [Gunship] (to unknown synergy - not a big issue as it’s the start ship).

Harpy [LR] to Synergy 4.

Iron Harpy [LR] to unknown synergy (probably 6).

Steel Harpy [LR] to unknown synergy (probably 6).

 

You then have to not take the Hydra 2 [Engineer] at Rank 6 and take the Hydra [LR] instead.

 

Then you fly the Acid Hydra [LR], the Cerberus [LR] and finally you’re allowed to fly the Styx.

 

One Gunship and Seven Long Range Frigates to unlock the Rank 9 Engineer for the Empire… having been forced to skip their Rank 6 Engineer along the way.

 

Crazy…

The worst part of that is the lack of Gunships. LRF ARE the Empire’s mainstream Frigates, not Engineers, so if you want Imperial Frigates, you fly those, not Engies.

858

Give os the freedom back!

 

http://youtu.be/CdKVX45wYeQ?t=16s

859

I was thinking (from long time actually) if couldnt be better remove ranks at all and leave only tiers. Than u put every kind of ship in every faction… and people just chose to fly a certain ship model from a fation or another basing on bonuses.

 

Whit new system u could do u need at least 2 ship at full sinergy in a tier for unlock the next tier.

860

Some kind of total synergy progression model would be best in my opinion. For example, if it takes 500,000 synergy to max out a Rank 4 ship, then you should have to amass 500,000 synergy across your Rank 4 ships to advance to rank 5. Tiers would likewise have overall caps - to get to T3 you could either max out three T2 ships, or max out the one you like and dabble in the others or any combination thereof.

It makes skipping crap ships a valid option, but if you do so you need to be ranking up other branches to make sure you’ve got enough total synergy to allow advancement.