New Ship-class/Frigate Sub-class

Suggestions Balance
1

Hello,

 

I have seen threads on this forum before about people requesting a larger ship class than Frigates, yet still much smaller than dreadnoughts, and time and again those threads have been pushed under the rug.  I’ve got a really good, simple, idea for a larger ship class.  However, I want to know why the devs do not wish to add a last large ship class to the game.

 

Nearly every space game I have ever played there have been capital ships.  Freelancer, Homeworld, Star Citizen (I know, it’s not out yet, but the important part is that there are cap ships in it), Starpoint Gemini, Strike Suit Zero, Nexus, hell even Wing Commander!  The coolest part was seeing (or piloting) those big beasts chugging through space, slamming eachother at a distance while smaller ships weaved around them.

 

Now I know, we’ve got the Dreadnought battle mode, and it’s really cool!  But I feel that, as players, we should have the option to be able to pilot something where you feel like you’re driving a freight train and you could take down a mountain in the process.  The largest ship class we have now, the Frigates, definitely are tough, but you still feel pretty nimble in them and I never feel like you get to use your turrets like turrets (if you know what I mean).  I’m not saying we should be able to pilot a Dreadnought, that is out of the question.  I’m just saying something larger than a Frigate that feels heavy.

 

Anyway, I’ll state my idea if this thread gathers any traction at all.  But for now, I’d like to know the Devs’ reasoning for leaving out what feels like to me is a very important part of any space combat game.

 

 

 

Striving for the betterment of one of my favorite games,

-Hix

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2

I’d love the idea of capships myself, but that doesn’t really fit in with the arcade-y nature of this game. Frigates are already very slow and tanky when it comes to the meta, and throwing in a big capital ship porker would make things very frigbally and would mean the death of countless interceptors before the capital goes down.

 

For regular PvP, that would mean the capital ship would take forever to reach a beacon in Domination, which would make the pilot effectively useless for half the battle.

 

Not that the idea isn’t cool though - it is - it just doesn’t fit with this game.

3

True.  However, could you say it could be balanced to a certain point where it would be viable to use in PvP scenarios?

 

I would say, if it were to be balanced well you would need to create new “XL” sized modules and weapons only suitable the capital ships.  They would only be able to use those modules and weapons.

 

The XL weapons would not be effective against smaller ships and have a very slow reload rate, but would pack a serious punch.  The XL modules could consist of only either tactical or maneuverability modules.  Such as, a module that increases your overall speed for a short time, but disallows you to fire your XL weapons until the module is deactivated/runs its course (thus allowing the pilot of a capital ship to be relatively useful in a capture mode, if used correctly).

 

 

XL Weapons  (Cap ships could only have 2-3 XL weapon turrets)

1 for each damage type

-Could act similarly to the heavy weapons that were in the Beta, with slow barrel turn rates.

-Capital ships would have verrrry slow targeting rates, as to avoid OPing the first weapon vvv (as well as other factors)

 

-Cruise Missile launcher (Kinetic?)

          Verrry slow turn rate, as to not be effective against interceptors

          Large explosion radius

          Unlimited missile ammo/very high amounts allowed, but very slow reload rate

-Heavy laser turret (Thermal?)

         Very slow turret turn rate, not very effective at close range

         Almost like a Heavy, long range Ion Emitter

-Need idea for a 3rd haha

 

With the very limited maneuverability and the slow turret barrels, you’d be wondering “Well heck, I’ll get shredded by Interceptors!”  In order to counter that fact, to some degree, these capital ships’ “Special Ability” would be that they would have 2 weapon systems.  The 1st would be the XL weapons, the 2nd would be “point defense weapons”, similar to/using the general interceptor weapons but not as powerful as those on an actual interceptor.  There would be 4 PD weapons mounted on a capital ship, but in spots to where you could only fire 2-3 _at the most _at one time/in one direction.  

 

The special ability button would just switch between the 2 weapon systems.  In part of the Beta, we were allowed to have 2 different ammunition types on most guns that you could switch between at will. So I would imagine 2 weapon systems wouldn’t be toooo hard to integrate.

4

I’d think that the engineer could be reworked in to a heavier class.it would function as it does currently, but instead of having weapons like other ships, it would have fleets of drones to attack for it, along with one central cannon of some sort. It would have all the modules associated with engineers, like the barrier, warp-gate, and regens. It would still work in the game, but would just mean that they would be a lot slower and more of a support class.

5

It would be cool to see the Engineer reworked as a carrier/healer!  

 

With this new XL class of ships, it would add another support type ship (which I think we need).  If anything you could swing it as just adding another Frigate class-type ship, but just larger, more hitpoints (it wouldn’t have a phase shield like a guard though, so those hitpoints would drain fast), and different weapons.

 

However, I feel it would be more suited towards its own ship-class, as the Frigate chassis is too small for this type of ship.

6

Bigger ships for a single pilot do not fit into the game concept.

The bigger the ship, the slower it is and the more hull and shield points. Capital ships would reach an amount of hull and shield points, where it would be impossible for Interceptors to kill them and this would have a huge impact on the overall balance.

7

Closest thing we have to this is dreadnought battles. Those are certainly capital ships.

 

It would, however, be nice to see some capital ships floating around in open space. I remember having a quest where some Jericho guy mentioned bringing in their cruisers to blow a thing up. I’ve never seen a Jericho cruiser, and I’d be curious to do so.

8

OK so we already know that Larger ships would have too much armor and too small speed to play. But about a little modernization for Combat Recon mode? Captain of each team gets “Capital ship” Instantly when choosen as a captain.

Have some special modules and weapons. It could look like>

When you are choosen to be a captain your ships palette is changed with Capital Ships pallete. There is:

 

Jericho Capital Ship = 50k shields (x Tier, so at T5 its 250 000).    Top Speed 140. (AB 170).  Hull = 30k (+5k per tier) Jericho Bonus : All nearby allies shield resistances are increased by 40. Weapon type: Kinetic

 

Imperial Capital Ship = 30k shields (+5k per tier),  Top Speed 130 (AB 160). Hull = 50k(x Tier)   Imperial Bonus : All nearby allies damage is increased by 10%. Weapon type: Thermal

 

Federation Capital Ship = 40k shields (+30k per tier), Top Speed 170 (AB 220), Hull = 40k (+30k per tier). Federation Bonus : All nearby allies Speed is increased by 15% and Afterburner use decreased by 20%. Weapon tyle : Plasma

 

All of those ships could have special modules (F) that increases they battle capabilities according to faction. So  Imperial : +30%dmg,   Jerycho: +60 resist.  Federation : +30% speed & +20 roll.

 

Its my only idea for Capital ships to appear.

9

Bigger ships for a single pilot do not fit into the game concept.

The bigger the ship, the slower it is and the more hull and shield points. Capital ships would reach an amount of hull and shield points, where it would be impossible for Interceptors to kill them and this would have a huge impact on the overall balance.

Well maybe interceptors don’t kill them, but have special debuffs for them? I mean since when a small vehicle can destroy a bigger vehicle? Like let’s say an MS-1 vs KV-5, should the MS-1 be able to hit the KV-5? No. But since we’re in a spaceship game, there could be some useful debuffs, I have no idea about any debuff though. But I’d love to be able to pilot a huge space ship, and see other pilots in interceptors as dots.

 

Hmm… Maybe the interceptors can lay some kind of a really strong bomb on the cap ships? These ONLY can be used on cap ships, and would drain lots of their health. But of course, the cap ship can’t protect it self against this (maybe it can with a module) but instead, the team must work together and kill that interceptor before it lays the bomb.

10

Well maybe interceptors don’t kill them, but have special debuffs for them? I mean since when a small vehicle can destroy a bigger vehicle? Like let’s say an MS-1 vs KV-5, should the MS-1 be able to hit the KV-5? No. But since we’re in a spaceship game, there could be some useful debuffs, I have no idea about any debuff though. But I’d love to be able to pilot a huge space ship, and see other pilots in interceptors as dots.

 

Hmm… Maybe the interceptors can lay some kind of a really strong bomb on the cap ships? These ONLY can be used on cap ships, and would drain lots of their health. But of course, the cap ship can’t protect it self against this (maybe it can with a module) but instead, the team must work together and kill that interceptor before it lays the bomb.

This is not EvE, the whole game is revolving about ArcadePewPewTypeOfGame, PvP maps are very small room with not much space in them, you can not possibly fit bigger than frigate ships into them, whole balance of the game was made revolving 3 ship sizes.

Big slow capital ships simply do not belong in this game, (unless made static in special game mode like Dreadnoughts).

All these EvE inspired mechanics, like huge pilot controlled ships, transports, caravans and so for for Open Space simply should not be in this game, they will not bring anything into this game, and only make it worse.

11

I say the more content the better. And if you don’t like it, don’t use it. ^^

12

This is not EvE, the whole game is revolving about ArcadePewPewTypeOfGame, PvP maps are very small room with not much space in them, you can not possibly fit bigger than frigate ships into them, whole balance of the game was made revolving 3 ship sizes.

Big slow capital ships simply do not belong in this game, (unless made static in special game mode like Dreadnoughts).

All these EvE inspired mechanics, like huge pilot controlled ships, transports, caravans and so for for Open Space simply should not be in this game, they will not bring anything into this game, and only make it worse.

I never ever played EvE, but no one said cap ships should only be used for PvP, maybe limit them to a new special mode AND open space, cuz you know everyone will love to pilot a big ship around in space.

13

Bigger ships for a single pilot do not fit into the game concept.

The bigger the ship, the slower it is and the more hull and shield points. Capital ships would reach an amount of hull and shield points, where it would be impossible for Interceptors to kill them and this would have a huge impact on the overall balance.

 

Ah, thank you Error.  This is true and does make sense.  However, what would you say if this “XL” ship class did not have _massive _amounts of hitpoints, but only a small percentage more than a Guard Frigate.  And not nearly the level of Tanky-ness of a Guard Frigate, since it would not have a Phase shield.  Those Hitpoints would go down pretty fast if you attacked said ship in the right way, just like every other ship in the game.  Right now, if the conditions are right, I can take down a T3 Guard Frigate with a T3 Recon Interceptor.  If balanced correctly this new ship could be taken down by an individual, and if the Pilot knows what he is doing it could be a weapon of destruction (Just like every other ship in this game).

 

All these EvE inspired mechanics, like huge pilot controlled ships, transports, caravans and so for for Open Space simply should not be in this game, they will not bring anything into this game, and only make it worse.

 

This idea is not inspired by EVE, EVE’s ships are grotesquely huge to the point that it just doesn’t make sense.  This idea is inspired by nearly every other space game that I have seen or played.

 

This new “XL” type ship would not be this massive thing flying around.  Think of the Alien Hunter, it is a little larger than a Guard frigate.  This ship class would not be much larger than an Inquisitor Guard frigate, if anything just a little longer to accommodate the extra weapon systems.

 

Like I said earlier, this ship class could Pass as just another Frigate sub-class, and the actual ship’s size would be just a little bigger than current existing Frigate Chassis.  You could call the new sub-class “Gunboat” or “Aegis” or something along those lines.

14

This idea is not inspired by EVE, EVE’s ships are grotesquely huge to the point that it just doesn’t make sense.  This idea is inspired by nearly every other space game that I have seen or played.

 

This new “XL” type ship would not be this massive thing flying around.  Think of the Alien Hunter, it is a little larger than a Guard frigate.  This ship class would not be much larger than an Inquisitor Guard frigate, if anything just a little longer to accommodate the extra weapon systems.

Star Conflict is like no other space themed game, and the only thing it does have in common with them is the space them, that is about it. A lot of things that make sense in “other space games” do not make sense in realities of Star Conflict.

Invasion mode “aka open space” is just it a MODE, it is an addition to the core of this game which is session PvP, invasion is session based too cause it uses same mechanics, same for PvE it is a mode that is an addition to PvP. Invasion mode did grow big but it never become something separate, majority of players in this game is because of its core - PvP and creating something like this specifically to Invasion/PvE does not make sense from game development standpoint nor it is good for the core of the game.

15

 

Ah, thank you Error.  This is true and does make sense.  However, what would you say if this “XL” ship class did not have _massive _amounts of hitpoints, but only a small percentage more than a Guard Frigate.  And not nearly the level of Tanky-ness of a Guard Frigate, since it would not have a Phase shield.  Those Hitpoints would go down pretty fast if you attacked said ship in the right way, just like every other ship in the game.  Right now, if the conditions are right, I can take down a T3 Guard Frigate with a T3 Recon Interceptor.  If balanced correctly this new ship could be taken down by an individual, and if the Pilot knows what he is doing it could be a weapon of destruction (Just like every other ship in this game).

This way they would be bigger and a far bigger target and far easier to hit -> why play instead of a Frigate?

16

This way they would be bigger and a far bigger target and far easier to hit -> why play instead of a Frigate?

 

I understand that the idea of Capital Ships does not work with Star Conflict.  

 

So, in light of that, this new Ship Design could be more of a “hit-and-run” type ship.  *It flies in (relatively) fast, fires its heavy guns, then flies out*  It would be slightly fragile, but not paperthin like an Long Range Frigate, yet still able to hold it’s own on a 1v1 (if used correctly).  Try doing a hit-and-run in a guard or LRF frigate, it often won’t work too well.

 

If the general class for the ship were to be changed like this, targeting times would need to be adjusted, as well as a few other things, but it would still be a viable idea.

 

As far as the chassis is concerned, it would only be a tad bigger than its other Frigate counterparts with its main focus being on pure firepower instead of offensive modules

17

I understand that the idea of Capital Ships does not work with Star Conflict.

So, in light of that, this new Ship Design could be more of a “hit-and-run” type ship. *It flies in (relatively) fast, fires its heavy guns, then flies out* It would be slightly fragile, but not paperthin like an Long Range Frigate, yet still able to hold it’s own on a 1v1 (if used correctly). Try doing a hit-and-run in a guard or LRF frigate, it often won’t work too well.

If the general class for the ship were to be changed like this, targeting times would need to be adjusted, as well as a few other things, but it would still be a viable idea.

As far as the chassis is concerned, it would only be a tad bigger than its other Frigate counterparts with its main focus being on pure firepower instead of offensive modules

First off, there is already a class in the game designed for this sort of thing:Covert Ops. Secondly, hit and run guards and lrfs do exist and work well, but only can exist at T3+

18

There’s always my engineer rework idea. Just sayin.

19

So, in light of that, this new Ship Design could be more of a “hit-and-run” type ship.  *It flies in (relatively) fast, fires its heavy guns, then flies out*  It would be slightly fragile, but not paperthin like an Long Range Frigate, yet still able to hold it’s own on a 1v1 (if used correctly).

this kind of ship is already in the game, the CovOps. Don’t forgett that in SC, all ships no matter how small or big they are have the same firepower. Introducing a ship that has bigger guns than anything would betray this concept. Yes the CovOps has the plasma arch but at huge costs, you have to get 400-600m close to your target and you can only use it once every 40 or so seconds.Technically it’s not even a weapon but a module, so it still fits the concept.

20

has to get within 200m

FTFY