Desintegrator balance

Suggestions Balance
101

Heres the thing.  A harpy in teir 1 takes 3 hits to take out a frigate.  With a near instant hit weapon and can be fired repeatedly.  Now compared to the other factions specials who either A, have a very limited range, or B in the case of jerhico actually have to be sitting vulnerable while using it.

 

At teirs 2 and 3 you at least have enough modules etc to survive it or counter it, but in teir 1 only battles its just uncounterable unless you hit the guy with 3 jerhico torps at the same time, which is not likely.  I would suggest giving the harpy a shorter ranged weapon so they could at least be counterable to what they face.

 

I agree something needs to be done, Maybe not shorter range but I don’t know. The worst part though is if you have 2-3 sniper frigs AND 2-3 torps frigs. with the others being brawlers and you effectively have NO WHERE to hide. If you are on coms and get get something going then that’s great but what most people don’t get is the other side needs very little co-ordination to stay alive and “cover” each other because they are always in range if they have LOS to cover each other. Then you have to (if playing with a PUG) get communications open and honestly 90% of the time people don’t respond because you cant in a fight or even near enemies without running the risk of dieing. Now this might not be so bad in other types but I play regualr and not arcade. So you lose a ship then you have to choose another and so on until you win or game over. I was playing a game today where they had (enemy team) about 9 frigs (mix of torp and snipe) and only 3 bots (so 6 players). So you and a buddy fly in IF you kill one (which with two people it is a good bet you will even with cover) you will either lose your wing man, you die or you may both die. Normally the only time both of us make it out is they weren’t properly covering each other and god forbid a torp frig fired in our direction before we finish of the sniper (very possible if they are paying attention)

 

There are a few ways to make things happen if you are co-ordinating but more often then not you aren’t. So how do we “fix” this? By this I mean how do we make multiple sniper and torp ships that only require you to be able to see your team make and not have to plan it out in detail before the match work with other ships requiring a lot more communication to do anything against the sniper Blob that most people understand is OP in tier 1 (even if it’s fine above t1)

 

Also as I was parked in my crappy Fed Frig I was hit TWICE in the back by torps from a bot (on my team) and killed while dogfighting (Either later in the match or the next one, i can’t remember) by a player. I think a team kill penalty is in order. We also NEED ai tweaks though so they stop torping us.

 

  • about what you said SuperDeluxe

 

“Dunno if it’s really useful to rebalance them in T1. Yes they are OP in that tier but that s a good thing. People in T1 do fear them, and are forced to find counters, that way they do learn something. They don’t stay long in T1 and when in T2 sniper is not OP anymore and people now know how to deal with it from their experience in T1”

 

The problem is this right here, what you said will cost them customers and people who jump in and have choosen Fed or who honestly really want to fly lighter faster ship and don’t like frigs will get fed up, no pun intended. This isn’t how you want people to feel about getting higher lvl or tier in a game. “Well, this is broken now but if I try really hard I get to the next set and it’s balanced!” You want players to feel like they can have a chance early later in the game without another class or “ship” in this case feeling like they just cant beat it, shouldn’t matter if it’s T1, 2, 3 or 10. you don’t want them feeling that way because the game will sour quickly and you then have 0% chance of money from the customer.

 

I don’t want snipers to get WTFPWND by every n00b in any other ship. If the guy in the sniper or torp frig is better than me he deserves to win unless i brought help, but if I get to him after managing to not get hit and get in close because I don’t have a weapon with 10000+ range on it not to mention avoiding all the other ships on the way I should have a better chance in that situation.  Alas with the fact that he’s probably in his spawn camping and might even be on a beacon so I have to deal with drones, the chance drops lower and lower with every variable.

102

You may try to extend the range of your torpedo and outrange him or you can hide. Sniper ability requires a LOS to fire upon an ennemy, torpedo does not, so get yourself a cover before engaging the sniper frigate and he won’t be able to return fire…

 

That’s not what I’m talking about. Even from cover and landing torpedoes from 8k or more, a Jericho Frigate will not kill a Disruptor based Frigate. With the same shield and hull mods, their shield is repaired to full by the the torpedo gets to it again. Let alone if a friend is near by with one as well.

103

The problem is this right here, what you said will cost them customers and people who jump in and have choosen Fed or who honestly really want to fly lighter faster ship and don’t like frigs will get fed up, no pun intended. This isn’t how you want people to feel about getting higher lvl or tier in a game. “Well, this is broken now but if I try really hard I get to the next set and it’s balanced!” You want players to feel like they can have a chance early later in the game without another class or “ship” in this case feeling like they just cant beat it, shouldn’t matter if it’s T1, 2, 3 or 10. you don’t want them feeling that way because the game will sour quickly and you then have 0% chance of money from the customer.

 

Yeah you probably right. When I fail or die in games, I always telling myself it is my fault and not a game bad design. So i try to learn the mechanism as much as I can, then improve my gameplay accordingly to what the game asks of me to finally overcome difficulties. But it seems it s not the case for everyone, and it may (he sniper thing), like you said, make some people go away from the game.

 

Ok let’s nerf the frigate sniping ability, I 'm not against that. Problem is, lowering the overall difficulty won’t make people fly better. Then they will cry about something else, and we can’t nerf everything. Just look at how World of Tanks works, lower tiers get pwned by higher tiers tanks, top tank being very strong and resilient against half of the opposite team, does that make people flee from the game, I don’t think so, seeing how this game has been successful for the last 2 years.

I’m a Ace too you know, playing maybe for 5/7 days now, got a 1.75 win ratio, 1500+ rating, it’s not good but not bad either I guess, people in my team do fly in interceptors and fighters and have same performances. The only difference between me and most whiners is, I’m trying to learn how to counter any new tactics I may encounter in battle. 

 

But ok let’s nerf the sniper ability, then you’ll have to nerf torpedoes, then interceptor speed and agility, then cloaking system, then pulsars, then mines, then regens… You ll end up in nerfing everything because some people prefer crying on forums instead of trying to improve their gameplay.

And one day, people will remember how snipers camping their spawns were not contributing at all to their team, making that team loose the game, and will miss those days…

104

That’s not what I’m talking about. Even from cover and landing torpedoes from 8k or more, a Jericho Frigate will not kill a Disruptor based Frigate. With the same shield and hull mods, their shield is repaired to full by the the torpedo gets to it again. Let alone if a friend is near by with one as well.

But the sniper frigate won’t kill you either since he can’t have a LOS on you. A stalemate, but that s still better than being killed. Remember those weapons are not main weapons, and are not supposed to be your main source of damage, let alone main way of killing people.

105

But the sniper frigate won’t kill you either since he can’t have a LOS on you. A stalemate, but that s still better than being killed. Remember those weapons are not main weapons, and are not supposed to be your main source of damage, let alone main way of killing people.

 

This is in response to this and what you said to me. You say it’s not the main way to deal damage but in T1 it is, that’s the problem. Also I am staying in T1 to try and learn to counter it. I also try to counter and learn but from what I have seen and from what you already know it is OP in T1. I don’t want to *Nerf* everything. I just want to “Balance”  each tier within it self, that’s how balance works.  It’s in Beta, I think they need our feedback, and please understand I’m not yelling “NERF EVERYTHING THAT KILLS ME!”

106

Yeah but thread is not about T1 balance only afaik. It is about disintegrator balance, as title says. So even we agreed it is OP in tier 1, please do not reduce the subject on tier 1 only. Each time i’m giving tips or arguments, people try to invalidate it by saying “but… but… tier 1…”. Thread and thread category is about weapons, not about T1 balance.

Ok it’s OP in tier 1, we all agreed on this already, now if thread is about that ability, not only in T1, getting those “but in T1” in reply to each tips given will get us nowhere…

107

The best way to sort out Empire/Jericho frigs would be to have them have less “normal” weapons. I’d like to see them work with only 2 or 4 lasers for point defence, since they’re so strong in ranged combat and tanking, requiring them to have ships defending and not be pwnmobiles.

108

The best way to sort out Empire/Jericho frigs would be to have them have less “normal” weapons. I’d like to see them work with only 2 or 4 lasers for point defence, since they’re so strong in ranged combat and tanking, requiring them to have ships defending and not be pwnmobiles.

 

This could work quite well, and if it’s a problem at higher tiers they could always leave those untouched if messing with them would cause unbalance

109

Heres an idea, take the jerhico and empire frigs and give them 5 guns and then give the fed one another turret, indicating its role as a brawler.

110

The best way to sort out Empire/Jericho frigs would be to have them have less “normal” weapons. I’d like to see them work with only 2 or 4 lasers for point defence, since they’re so strong in ranged combat and tanking, requiring them to have ships defending and not be pwnmobiles.

 

They seem strong but can be defeated quickly. For example, I can take down a T2 empire frigate in less than 10 seconds, more like 5 seconds against a frigate without any resists, using a target painter and overdrive on. The frigate can’t do nothing about it, it is so quick, most people don’t have enough time to launch a defensive cooldown.

Dunno if I can do it in my T2 jericho fighter, but my Empire T2 fighter can do it for sure (because of the overdrive), already done it tons of time.

I’m now doing this because I was fed up being killed so quickly with my T2 and T3 super tanky frigates with more than 100 resists all on hull and 20k hull.

 

Anyway reducing their number of guns could work. Only if their 2x 360° guns are not concerned.

111

Do you think frigates should be fighting closer more? 

 

My friend and I had the idea that Jericho should be more a missile boat, target 5 targets (or one target 5 times) and launch 5 special missiles. 60 second cooldown. Empire beam is locked to the ship’s facing. but fires longer and wider. Laser takes time to charge, and a high energy warning gets broadcasted into the area. The ship can move but not fire main weapons. Beam fires for some time so it can move around. Secondary effects of the beam affect targets next to the main beam. 60 or 45 second cooldown. 

112

Why is this thread called desintigrator balance? The Disentigrater is the Sniper firg weapon. You all aren’t even remotely discussing it…

 

On Frigs however, Personally I think they are all underpowered, especially their main weapons (3k max damage at t4… come on really?), A Fighter or Inty should NEVER be able to solo a frig in my opinion. Their big tank ships yet they fail at one thing… Tanking… Espcially shown in the PVE missions where they can be 3-4 shotted by the main bosses.

 

Things that Frigs need:

 

Serious Buff to defense of all Frigs across the board:

* At least 50 (starting) Points of resistance in every single attribute for shield and hull on all Factions frigs.

* Main weapon damage at T3 and T4 are severely under powered, they should do minimum of 5k - 10k damage (AFTER Resists) Per hit instead of the weak and measly 2-3k after resists. I mean seriously… 5 direct hits to kill an inty and 20-30 to kill a frig on the sniper frigs… Ridiculous…

113

I even be happy giving up a pair of guns on us so we 4 for more defenses 

114

I have Acid Hydra… it is very easy to kill it… usually interceptors … are the pain in the a.s.s from 10 battles 1vs1 prob 7 will be win by interceptor …  fighters…  are more durable … but are easy to hit them … now the sniper it is under power… i cant kill a Jericho frigate, that fast… they shields regenerate to fast… so prob… its a topic made by interceptor player or fighter. game it is balanced @ 70% … some fixes 1-2 there.

 

Another aspect… we have rubbish hull resistance. if u are a smart player … u can click on ships tab in game , and look at the ships hull & shield def stats…  example … my Acid Hydra hull it is useless vs kinetic dmg. but better vs em`s and mid for thermal dmg. they are 2 types of builds … hull strength ( % )or hull resistance (pts). same for shield builds. as i play as hull strength… i have to stay away from kinetic weapons…

 

It is not OP or UP … snipers are campers.  they kill little things. if u stay and don’t make evasion moves u will die…  usually we don`t snipe frigates … they are hard to kill, main targets interceptors, fighters, and Becon Drones.

115

Don’t tell me that you can’t kill frigs with desi. In T3 the base damage is around 4k, reload is 3 sec, skill descripton sais you can shoot 17 times in a min. So your base (no dot, no scaling with main weapon) dps is 68k thermal. When i fly with my fed frig my worst enemy is the empire snipers. They hit 2k+ on me in every 3 sec, and i’m dead in 10 shot (most of the time there are 2 snipers concentrating fire to 1 target so i’m dead in 15 sec xD)

Desintegrator hits like a standard missile, but you can shot with it as many times as you want, and its range is the best .

Its damage is good, but its dps is too high imho (= i would like longer reload time).

 

Edited: ty Benache.

116

*its

117

Why is this thread called desintigrator balance? The Disentigrater is the Sniper firg weapon. You all aren’t even remotely discussing it…

 

On Frigs however, Personally I think they are all underpowered, especially their main weapons (3k max damage at t4… come on really?), A Fighter or Inty should NEVER be able to solo a frig in my opinion. Their big tank ships yet they fail at one thing… Tanking… Espcially shown in the PVE missions where they can be 3-4 shotted by the main bosses.

 

Things that Frigs need:

 

Serious Buff to defense of all Frigs across the board:

* At least 50 (starting) Points of resistance in every single attribute for shield and hull on all Factions frigs.

* Main weapon damage at T3 and T4 are severely under powered, they should do minimum of 5k - 10k damage (AFTER Resists) Per hit instead of the weak and measly 2-3k after resists. I mean seriously… 5 direct hits to kill an inty and 20-30 to kill a frig on the sniper frigs… Ridiculous…

 

Anyone else find this post absolutely hilarious? Acting like a language police and not even typing it properly ( Disintegrator ) himself lol, can’t even type Frig.

 

And his opinions seem so biased anyway, propably a troll.

 

Go camp more in the frigates and contribute nothing to winning the game.

 

Whoever outside T1 says Frigates are overpowered needs to get their head checked.

118

Anyone else find this post absolutely hilarious? Acting like a language police and not even typing it properly ( Disintegrator ) himself lol, can’t even type Frig.

And his opinions seem so biased anyway, propably a troll.

Please ignore Airsuicide, he is our resident fail troll, or was. I haven’t seen him posting in some time.

119

I have Acid Hydra… it is very easy to kill it… usually interceptors … are the pain in the a.s.s from 10 battles 1vs1 prob 7 will be win by interceptor …  fighters…  are more durable … but are easy to hit them … now the sniper it is under power… i cant kill a Jericho frigate, that fast… they shields regenerate to fast… so prob… its a topic made by interceptor player or fighter. game it is balanced @ 70% … some fixes 1-2 there.

 

Another aspect… we have rubbish hull resistance. if u are a smart player … u can click on ships tab in game , and look at the ships hull & shield def stats…  example … my Acid Hydra hull it is useless vs kinetic dmg. but better vs em`s and mid for thermal dmg. they are 2 types of builds … hull strength ( % )or hull resistance (pts). same for shield builds. as i play as hull strength… i have to stay away from kinetic weapons…

 

It is not OP or UP … snipers are campers.  they kill little things. if u stay and don’t make evasion moves u will die…  usually we don`t snipe frigates … they are hard to kill, main targets interceptors, fighters, and Becon Drones.

 

This whole post smells like a huge troll post.

 

Dying to Intys in Frigates?

Not being able to kill a Jericho Frig lol?

Crap resistances? Your own fault for not fitting your ships right.

 

Acid Hydra is propably the most durable T2 Frigate out there right now.

 

L2p or stop trolling.

120

I gave up on all other Frigates and take Empire exclusively now.  

 

Since last week though I’ve seen a lot more Jericho missile boats … has there been a buff?

 

It might be worth letting the dust settle before taking a nerf stick to the Disintegrator.  

While its horrible if you are another Frigate, I don’t have too much trouble staying in asteroids and moving fast.  

I do play Interceptors and peek-a-boo when I am in Fighters though.