Ze'ta, for the 1001st time.

Suggestions PvP
1

How many times do players have to open up a topic to repeatedly point out that Ze’ta is broken beyond measure? Does every balance-issued game developer really think that it is correct the way it is in right now?
If the answer is yes, what is the point of releasing any other destroyers for the rest of the factions then? It is stupidly obvious that Ze’ta has no competitor that would stand against it - are you convinced that Relic or Emperor are anything in comparison ? NOWHERE NEAR.

A single  (yes, single, not 2, not 3, not X amount of ships - if your comparison has to be based on x ships vs 1 , then it is somewhat flawed don’t you think ?) CovOps/Gunship (unless, again, it is a singularity Thar’ga - ellydium ship, what a surprise  ![:facepalm:](<fileStore.core_Emoticons>/emoticons/014j.png “:facepalm:”)) has a slim chance of destroying a Ze’ta - and we’re talking about 2 ship types that are almost exactly designed to do it. 
After literally  years,  Albireo is the first dessie that has come atleast close and it still doesn’t do stuff that Ze’ta casually pulls off. Reasons? Here they are:

 

Crystalline suppressor -  this module is beyond stupid, it is a one shot one kill kind of a deal, NOT EVEN mentioning its healing aspect (On serious a note, a module that gets you down or to an emergency barrier activation instantly on a 40 seconds cooldown ? What the actual f**k were developers thinking when designing it ?)

Swarm -  yes, you’re reading right, swarm - ever flown a different destroyer facing a Ze’ta several kilometers away? Yeah? Then you know what it feels like to get smashed to smithereens by a swarm that when destroyed, doesn’t mean anything exceptional to the Ze’ta, except a very slight disadvantage (coz yeah, you will receive a bonus even after the swarm gets rekt). Yep, sounds fair  ![:wacko:](<fileStore.core_Emoticons>/emoticons/wacko.gif “:wacko:”)

Resistances/regen/durability/speed and actually stats in general  - the fact, that Ze’ta can roughly tank like 2-3 times as much damage than the Empire destroyer counterpart is at the very least ridiculous - and when such an attempt ends up being unsuccessful, it will just heal up in a minute…TO GODDAMN FULL HULL/SHIELD. And all this, gentlemen, with a speed higher than of a Federation 3x engine slotted destroyer .

 

And do you know what is even more ridiculous than the fact that this ship exists as it exists? The fact that this**
exact same issue**
has been addressed several times before and yet it still is not resolved
. 

Honestly, I have no clue what the idea behind this really is, because such a feature hurts you even economically from the standpoint of yours as the developers (coz players will rather leave after a while than remain if they will see that such a ship exists and wrecks everything in its path - basically narrowing the choice of a dessie pick from a total of 13 ships to 1 ).

2

I say just remove Ellydium from PvP modes. (Not OS obviously)

 

Quick n dirty fix.

 

Then they can be un-nerfed to their original glory to be obnoxious in other modes.

3

2 hours ago, TheDarkRedFox said:

I say just remove Ellydium from PvP modes. (Not OS obviously)

 

Quick n dirty fix.

 

Then they can be un-nerfed to their original glory to be obnoxious in other modes.

Not what I had in mind honestly, but I actually agree - the LEAST op ship of the bunch is Waz’got and yet it is the most powerful engineer. 

Ellydium as a whole is fundamentally f***ed, coz balancing apparently absolutelly misses them.

4

7 hours ago, DaRealSlimOopsie said:

If the answer is yes, what is the point of releasing any other destroyers for the rest of the factions then? It is stupidly obvious that Ze’ta has no competitor that would stand against it - are you convinced that Relic or Emperor are anything in comparison ? NOWHERE NEAR.

It’s name is Albireo - have fun trying to sort a counter meta for this one because I doubt the devs are going to do anything quickly for balance.

5

13 hours ago, TheDerpNukem said:

It’s name is Albireo - have fun trying to sort a counter meta for this one because I doubt the devs are going to do anything quickly for balance.

Covops with Decon, Orion, and Plasma knife. Ezpz.

Drop a nuke to kill Albert if he escapes in time.

6

22 hours ago, DaRealSlimOopsie said:

How many times do players have to open up a topic to repeatedly point out that Ze’ta is broken beyond measure? Does every balance-issued game developer really think that it is correct the way it is in right now?
If the answer is yes, what is the point of releasing any other destroyers for the rest of the factions then? It is stupidly obvious that Ze’ta has no competitor that would stand against it - are you convinced that Relic or Emperor are anything in comparison ? NOWHERE NEAR.

A single  (yes, single, not 2, not 3, not X amount of ships - if your comparison has to be based on x ships vs 1 , then it is somewhat flawed don’t you think ?) CovOps/Gunship (unless, again, it is a singularity Thar’ga - ellydium ship, what a surprise  ![:facepalm:](<fileStore.core_Emoticons>/emoticons/014j.png “:facepalm:”)) has a slim chance of destroying a Ze’ta - and we’re talking about 2 ship types that are almost exactly designed to do it. 
After literally  years,  Albireo is the first dessie that has come atleast close and it still doesn’t do stuff that Ze’ta casually pulls off. Reasons? Here they are:

 

Crystalline suppressor -  this module is beyond stupid, it is a one shot one kill kind of a deal, NOT EVEN mentioning its healing aspect (On serious a note, a module that gets you down or to an emergency barrier activation instantly on a 40 seconds cooldown ? What the actual f**k were developers thinking when designing it ?)

Swarm -  yes, you’re reading right, swarm - ever flown a different destroyer facing a Ze’ta several kilometers away? Yeah? Then you know what it feels like to get smashed to smithereens by a swarm that when destroyed, doesn’t mean anything exceptional to the Ze’ta, except a very slight disadvantage (coz yeah, you will receive a bonus even after the swarm gets rekt). Yep, sounds fair  ![:wacko:](<fileStore.core_Emoticons>/emoticons/wacko.gif “:wacko:”)

Resistances/regen/durability/speed and actually stats in general  - the fact, that Ze’ta can roughly tank like 2-3 times as much damage than the Empire destroyer counterpart is at the very least ridiculous - and when such an attempt ends up being unsuccessful, it will just heal up in a minute…TO GODDAMN FULL HULL/SHIELD. And all this, gentlemen, with a speed higher than of a Federation 3x engine slotted destroyer .

 

And do you know what is even more ridiculous than the fact that this ship exists as it exists? The fact that this**
exact same issue**
has been addressed several times before and yet it still is not resolved
. 

Honestly, I have no clue what the idea behind this really is, because such a feature hurts you even economically from the standpoint of yours as the developers (coz players will rather leave after a while than remain if they will see that such a ship exists and wrecks everything in its path - basically narrowing the choice of a dessie pick from a total of 13 ships to 1 ).

 

Do you have Ze’ta? 
I don’t think so. Most of the time survival of the ship comes from experience of the player, specific build and hours and hours of practice. In hands of a person that didn’t figure out how to play it - it’s as weak (or even weaker) than some of other destroyers. If you want to compare a good player on Ze’ta and good player on other type of ship - Ze’ta will almost always lose 1v1. If you want to compare a bad Ze’ta player against good player flying other ship - Ze’ta will always lose. Maybe not against a Jericho guard, but to all natural counters (covops, gunship, ECM, heck - even some healers, not to mention LRFs) it will go down and it will go down hard. Ze’ta seems so tanky but it actually isn’t. It can regen - yes, but it takes a lot of time, unless you have swarm control and enemy team is literally clueless what to do with you. But let’s address your concern in more detail:

 

Crystalline suppressor - can damage you only in case you will fly towards the Ze’ta and continue to fly straight even when you will see an initial explosion. To not fly straight is the general rule - it’s even in one of the prompts on the loading screens. It’s just bad play. 

 

Swarm control - it shouldn’t be in the game, not in this form actually. If you are flying a destroyer - kill the swarm first, then kill Ze’ta. If you are in the position Ze’ta can shoot the swarm at you - you are in wrong position. Don’t do that.
 

Regen - no. It doesn’t regen that fast unless you are talking about full regen with swarm control. Other dessies can regen faster. Emperor can heal order of magnitude faster than Ze’ta. 

 

People are choosing Ze’ta becasue you can shape it to your playstyle. Other destroyers are just not that flexible. And honestly - instead of nerfing Ze’ta itself I would buff other dessies. And remove Swarm Control. I would return Sirius to it’s diving role, Vigilant for long range support platform and tanky Tyrant. 

 

And honestly - most Ze’tas in pub PvP just suck. If I can kill them in an intie, anyone can. My main is actually Ze’ta. And even with hundreds of hours flying it - there are still people that can just wreck it. It can survive two gunship attacks with some luck, but then it’s out of battle for about a minute or so. If those attacks are simultaneous - it’s going down no matter the build. 

1 Like
7

21 hours ago, OwnageMaster said:

Do you have Ze’ta? 
I don’t think so. Most of the time survival of the ship comes from experience of the player, specific build and hours and hours of practice. In hands of a person that didn’t figure out how to play it - it’s as weak (or even weaker) than some of other destroyers. If you want to compare a good player on Ze’ta and good player on other type of ship - Ze’ta will almost always lose 1v1. If you want to compare a bad Ze’ta player against good player flying other ship - Ze’ta will always lose. Maybe not against a Jericho guard, but to all natural counters (covops, gunship, ECM, heck - even some healers, not to mention LRFs) it will go down and it will go down hard. Ze’ta seems so tanky but it actually isn’t. It can regen - yes, but it takes a lot of time, unless you have swarm control and enemy team is literally clueless what to do with you. But let’s address your concern in more detail:

But you most certainly do, right ?  You can’t even be serious about this paragraph, coz a statement like “Ze’ta is even weaker than some of the other destroyers” or that it “actually isn’t tanky” is plain bull***t. Despite the fact that I agree with “a bad Ze’ta means crap Ze’ta”, after you hit rank 15 with most nodes up you are pretty much the king on the hill (just in case you would come with stuff like Ze’ta has to be levelled up). And by the way, I got Ze’ta aswell, this ain’t just plain brainstorming.

 

 

21 hours ago, OwnageMaster said:

Crystalline suppressor - can damage you only in case you will fly towards the Ze’ta and continue to fly straight even when you will see an initial explosion. To not fly straight is the general rule - it’s even in one of the prompts on the loading screens. It’s just bad play. 

 

Swarm control - it shouldn’t be in the game, not in this form actually. If you are flying a destroyer - kill the swarm first, then kill Ze’ta. If you are in the position Ze’ta can shoot the swarm at you - you are in wrong position. Don’t do that.

Now here I’m just confused if you deliberatelly just act like you can’t see it or if you’re actually serious. What about the trigger range of the suppressor ? How do you exactly imagine dodging 6km/second projectile with such a ridiculous activation area? You got a chance, yeah, if you are an interceptor thats kitted with speed (or when the player piloting Ze’ta is braindead, coz that’s what you are pointing to here, which holds no value, because the same thing can be said about anything - if you’re dumb, it won’t work).
Advices like “you are in wrong position. Don’t do that.” have a similar impact like telling a blind man what movie he should see tonight - utterly useless and irrelevant (coz the swarm isn’t stationary you know, it isnt about positioning - especially if you are slow as hell on another destroyer)

And if you deem it okay for the swarm to be doing so much damage, then it is no surprise to me that you indeed are a Ze’ta main.

 

21 hours ago, OwnageMaster said:

People are choosing Ze’ta becasue you can shape it to your playstyle. Other destroyers are just not that flexible. And honestly - instead of nerfing Ze’ta itself I would buff other dessies. And remove Swarm Control. I would return Sirius to it’s diving role, Vigilant for long range support platform and tanky Tyrant. 

 

And honestly - most Ze’tas in pub PvP just suck. If I can kill them in an intie, anyone can. My main is actually Ze’ta. And even with hundreds of hours flying it - there are still people that can just wreck it. It can survive two gunship attacks with some luck, but then it’s out of battle for about a minute or so. If those attacks are simultaneous - it’s going down no matter the build. 

No, people are not choosing it because of the luxury of shaping it to your playstyle - they do pick it because you have an incredible edge over other destroyers in terms of stats, firepower, modules and speed. For an instance - no other destroyer packs the speed of Sirius, the tankiness of Tyrant and the firepower of Vigilant  at once - except for Ze’ta of course. 

So no, this is just plainly showing that people flying that ship are in a permanent denial when a term “Ze’ta is OP” comes to the table. Summarizations like when bad players will be bad pilots are just dumb, because that isn’t what’s being discussed here - I expect these comparissons to be done on the same skill level, and that’s when it’s broken.

8

21 hours ago, TheDarkRedFox said:

Covops with Decon, Orion, and Plasma knife. Ezpz.

Drop a nuke to kill Albert if he escapes in time.

Repelling drones.

9

9 minutes ago, TheDerpNukem said:

Repelling drones.

I have yet to meet an Alberto that used em

10

18 hours ago, DaRealSlimOopsie said:

But you most certainly do, right ?  You can’t even be serious about this paragraph, coz a statement like “Ze’ta is even weaker than some of the other destroyers” or that it “actually isn’t tanky” is plain bull***t. Despite the fact that I agree with “a bad Ze’ta means crap Ze’ta”, after you hit rank 15 with most nodes up you are pretty much the king on the hill (just in case you would come with stuff like Ze’ta has to be levelled up). And by the way, I got Ze’ta aswell, this ain’t just plain brainstorming.

 

 

Now here I’m just confused if you deliberatelly just act like an idiot or if you’re actually serious. What about the trigger range of the suppressor ? How do you exactly imagine dodging 6km/second projectile with such a ridiculous activation area? You got a chance, yeah, if you are an interceptor thats kitted with speed (or when the player piloting Ze’ta is braindead, coz that’s what you are pointing to here, which holds no value, because the same thing can be said about anything - if you’re dumb, it won’t work).
Advices like “you are in wrong position. Don’t do that.” have a similar impact like telling a blind man what movie he should see tonight - utterly useless and irrelevant (coz the swarm isn’t stationary you know, it isnt about positioning - especially if you are slow as hell on another destroyer)

And if you deem it okay for the swarm to be doing so much damage, then it is no surprise to me that you indeed are a Ze’ta main.

 

No, people are not f**king choosing it because of the luxury of shaping it to your playstyle - they do pick it because you have an incredible edge over other destroyers in terms of stats, firepower, modules and speed. For an instance - no other destroyer packs the speed of Sirius, the tankiness of Tyrant and the firepower of Vigilant  at once - except for Ze’ta of course. 

So no, this is just plainly showing that people flying that ship are in a permanent denial when a term “Ze’ta is OP” comes to the table. Summarizations like when bad players will be bad pilots are just dumb, because that isn’t what’s being discussed here - I expect these comparissons to be done on the same skill level, and that’s when it’s broken.

I think before you start to analyze the balance, modules and even gameplay, you should master some simpler skills - like reading with understanding.
I’ll wait for you to calm down, read my answers and edit yours to even be in a ballpark of discussion, not some kid throwing tantrum level. 
 

11

Yeeta isnt more broken than Emperor or Alberto

12

39 minutes ago, OwnageMaster said:

I think before you start to analyze the balance, modules and even gameplay, you should master some simpler skills - like reading with understanding.
I’ll wait for you to calm down, read my answers and edit yours to even be in a ballpark of discussion, not some kid throwing tantrum level. 
 

No tantrum ever thrown, just plain and straightforward thought process, noone offended (Or i guess there is one actually…) - I think this is where you should breathe in, breathe out, and realise its not the time nor place to elevate your “adulthood”, just stop with those orders and advices already, didn’t ask for them, not going to - leave if you will, not a single soul holding you.

13

1 hour ago, DaRealSlimOopsie said:

No tantrum ever thrown, just plain and straightforward thought process, noone offended (Or i guess there is one actually…) - I think this is where you should breathe in, breathe out, and realise its not the time nor place to elevate your “adulthood”, just stop with those orders and advices already, didn’t ask for them, not going to - leave if you will, not a single soul holding you.

“No tantrum ever thrown, just plain and straightforward thought process” - It definitely looked like one.

 

 

But yeah - let’s go one by one. 
 

20 hours ago, DaRealSlimOopsie said:

But you most certainly do, right ?  You can’t even be serious about this paragraph, coz a statement like “Ze’ta is even weaker than some of the other destroyers” or that it “actually isn’t tanky” is plain bull***t. Despite the fact that I agree with “a bad Ze’ta means crap Ze’ta”, after you hit rank 15 with most nodes up you are pretty much the king on the hill (just in case you would come with stuff like Ze’ta has to be levelled up). And by the way, I got Ze’ta aswell, this ain’t just plain brainstorming.

Ze’ta IS weaker than some of the other destroyers. That’s why you put as many resists you can. And I was asking if you have Ze’ta at all, because if you would, statement “after you hit the rank 15 with most nodes…” is a total BS. You have point budget to get maybe extra energy regen or two swarm related nodes from R15. Dunno what are you trying to do here. 

 

20 hours ago, DaRealSlimOopsie said:

Now here I’m just confused if you deliberatelly just act like you can’t see it or if you’re actually serious. What about the trigger range of the suppressor ? How do you exactly imagine dodging 6km/second projectile with such a ridiculous activation area?

Trigger range - it’s actually a range when crystalline suppressor detonates BEFORE the target - it’s not the range of AoE.  If you are flying parallel to the Ze’ta it won’t even hit you, unless you are flying slower than 150m/s. Hence what I said - don’t fly towards the Ze’ta. 

20 hours ago, DaRealSlimOopsie said:

Advices like “you are in wrong position. Don’t do that.” have a similar impact like telling a blind man what movie he should see tonight - utterly useless and irrelevant (coz the swarm isn’t stationary you know, it isnt about positioning - especially if you are slow as hell on another destroyer)

And if you deem it okay for the swarm to be doing so much damage, then it is no surprise to me that you indeed are a Ze’ta main.

 

22 hours ago, OwnageMaster said:

Swarm control - it shouldn’t be in the game, not in this form actually. If you are flying a destroyer - kill the swarm first, then kill Ze’ta. If you are in the position Ze’ta can shoot the swarm at you - you are in wrong position. Don’t do that.

I am not okay with the module at all. Reading skills sometimes help. Also that’s how I deal with the swarm.

 

20 hours ago, DaRealSlimOopsie said:

No, people are not choosing it because of the luxury of shaping it to your playstyle - they do pick it because you have an incredible edge over other destroyers in terms of stats, firepower, modules and speed. For an instance - no other destroyer packs the speed of Sirius, the tankiness of Tyrant and the firepower of Vigilant  at once - except for Ze’ta of course. 

 

Emperor, Albireo. Both of them have more survivability. Emperor is faster than Ze’ta as well. And can cloak. And it’s on par with Ze’ta regarding firepower. Oh and can regen 30k/s if anyone from the team has any brains. 

 

14

I’m the one who thought Ze’ta = hard to break, but not anymore.

I’m not very good at operating fighter (actually bad at), but still can pick up a fight with Ze’ta .
Of course, I cannot win every single Ze’ta, but can make it hurt.
The only thing you should avoid is getting hit by Crystal Suppressor or Sudden Photon Emitter burst.
Meaning that if someone is really good at operating fighter, he can hunt down Ze’ta very easily. 
Ze’ta is fragile, I can guarantee you.

15

On 2/5/2022 at 12:59 AM, Cr0 said:

I’m not very good at operating fighter (actually bad at)

??? Who is good then?