Everyone just remember: everything is working as intended. Except for most of the game.
What game ? Star Conflict World of Figates?
What game ? Star Conflict World of Figates?
Balance is a tricky thing, and since this game has a small team(From what I heard) it becomes even harder. Especially since everyone yells different things are OP.
There are a bunch of things that need balancing and changing to get this game ready for a full release in my eyes, but I’m not sure if the devs(Or anyone else for that matter) agree on that.
Well they could start stop listening what newbies and ppl playing from 1 or 2 weeks craying for (“Interceptors are op couse i’m totally unable to aim and can’t hit them… sig sig” or “Singularity is Op couse it can kill my interceptor in 1 second couse i’m totally unable to dodge… sig sig” … and bullshit like this) and start to take suggestions from veterans, people that really know and play the game …
… well what can i say… it could be a great start.
Couse this game at the moment isn’t more than a far echo of the game i was used to play and love (and support with my money). Now this is just World or Frigates… an ultra mega super boring static game.
Balance is a tricky thing, and since this game has a small team(From what I heard) it becomes even harder. Especially since everyone yells different things are OP.
There are a bunch of things that need balancing and changing to get this game ready for a full release in my eyes, but I’m not sure if the devs(Or anyone else for that matter) agree on that.
Currently one thing is brokenly OP, very obviously so - frigate torpedo. Everything else is peanuts in comparison.
Granted there are big problems like frigate health buff and interceptor health nerfs last patch were the exact opposite of what was needed. Right now, I need to overheat my supposed “anti frigate” singularity at T5 twice just to get through enemy shields with overdrive and aiming overcharge, which is utterly ridiculous as gunship is currently the most vulnerable ship in the game to counter fire and there’s simply no way in hell not to eat massive counter fire when firing under overdrive.
Reverse health changes in last patch to exact opposite (int buff, frigate nerf), remove or neuter torpedo and weaken the LFR back to acceptable levels, so that we can have a game where having a single ship like interceptor class means you’re weak, and not having it means you’re strong. Right now, having interceptors in your team means a certain loss while having mass frigates means a certain win, regardless of gameplay mode. Which is utterly ridiculous, even the worst of 0.8.x frigate conflict wasn’t that bad, at least flying an interceptor didn’t make you feel like you’re actively trolling your team.
I’ve spent entire day playing on a gunship. Not going to even touch interceptors until they’re not a team trolling tool, and frankly the whole “lalala, can’t even damage me” idiocy going with frigates has started to grind me down as well. Same kind of attitude is noticeable in several people I play with on regular basis.
Please return interceptors into the game and push frigate population from current >70% to more reasonable ~30% we had around 0.9.0. Thank you.
P.S. As usual, I’m talking about highest levels of T5. My matchmaking value hasn’t moved from 50 in ages.
Yah the torpedo is OP but the other thing is much important. Those guys took us the 4 men squad and gave us the new “great” matchmaking. So you are landing with your stong 3 men squad with some newbies in the same team doing everything to win but loose almost every time. The reasons are a strong T3 squad get almost any time T4s in enemy team and a lot of bad T3 players in they own. “Take this :)”-saying matchmaking. I was already fighting a T5 guard sitting in a T3 after this great patch.
Any way i will never buy another stuff and support this game
Yah the torpedo is OP but the other thing is much important. Those guys took us the 4 men squad and gave us the new “great” matchmaking. So you are landing with your stong 3 men squad with some newbies in the same team doing everything to win but loose almost every time. The reasons are a strong T3 squad get almost any time T4s in enemy team and a lot of bad T3 players in they own. “Take this :)”-saying matchmaking. I was already fighting a T5 guard sitting in a T3 after this great patch.
Any way i will never buy another stuff and support this game
I like the matchmaking. I was leveling up R10s and R11s in several ship classes against top r15 squads solo. It was and still is great fun - I enjoy the challenge. As a result I find that current matchmaking is perfectly fine.
Current state of game balance on the other hand makes sure that no matter who I play against, I should never pick anything but a gunship, command ship or frigate. Picking interceptors and tacklers should quite frankly be a bannable offense at this point, as it does nothing but trolls your team.
I like the matchmaking. I was leveling up R10s and R11s in several ship classes against top r15 squads solo. It was and still is great fun - I enjoy the challenge. As a result I find that current matchmaking is perfectly fine.
Current state of game balance on the other hand makes sure that no matter who I play against, I should never pick anything but a gunship, command ship or frigate. Picking interceptors and tacklers should quite frankly be a bannable offense at this point, as it does nothing but trolls your team.
report my 4 inti hangar then :crazy:
If you didn’t get assists for command buffs, what the hell would be the point in using them?
but should only get half as many points as you would if you assisted with actual damage. Same for the micro-locators etc.
you should only get an assist for command/engineer buffs if your teammate was less than 100% health 15 secs before the kill occurs… if they aren’t, you didn’t really assist anything :\
plus, buff/debuff assists give too much eff compared to damage assists. you can mass farm them… 20/30 buff/debuff assists in a game easily = 1200-1800 efficiency… plus you kills and caps…
but the worst i thinki in terms of efficiency farming are beacon caps: 300 points… for doing almost nothing.
you can have zero kills, zero assists, and end up with top score (almost), because your team is too busy killing people while you’re capping beacons behind the front lines… being as useless as ever.
for starters, raise kill points to 120, raise damage assists to 90, and buff/debuff may need to be lowered, but keep it the same for now. and lower beacon caps to 180 points.
Well they could start stop listening what newbies and ppl playing from 1 or 2 weeks craying for (“Interceptors are op couse i’m totally unable to aim and can’t hit them… sig sig” or “Singularity is Op couse it can kill my interceptor in 1 second couse i’m totally unable to dodge… sig sig” … and bullshit like this) and start to take suggestions from veterans, people that really know and play the game …
singularity is OP. i consistently get more kills with that than any other fighter weapon.
especially on tackler… just tackle and easy-button them to death… command kind of the same deal, pop shield an pummel target… assault is a bit trickier.
and interceptors are OP for several reason: they heal almost instantly around an engineer and speedtank on top of it, basically almost impossible to kill them around an engineer.
ecm disables and covert white noise are broken… they break almost every unit and not just the ones they are intended to counter.
white noise prevents you from even seeing the target correctly due to the red flashing graphic… so you can hit with singularity and maybe some other junk… but sniping = moronic… so they break their natural counter: snipers… they also break tacklers which are another ‘supposed’ counter… they can hide from ecms with camo, then white noise them…
we don’t even need to discuss how ecms break everyhting as well… in fact, xxxx everything about ecms…
and no, im not ‘crying’ because i’m a ‘newb’… i’m saying i can use these units to the same effect… and they are ridiculously OP.
recon is the only interceptor that is still somewhat balanced. shield transfer is still OP vs other inties… just like ecm energy absorber is… it drains your shields/cap completely to zero and keeps it there.
the problem is that these skills, and heal skills, etc heal/drain the same amount of inties and frigates… but they should have a larger effect on frigs…
oversight in game design basically… same goes for AOE damage… more damage to frigs, less to inties.
btw, you’re not a ‘veteran’… just saying…
Got inst-gibbed by a frig torpedo earlier. Instead of getting angry I realized, “Welp, I probably shouldn’t have flown at that guy in a straight line.”
I went back for more and managed to stay under the frigate’s belly: problem solved.
Also, in a different game, I was capturing a beacon and noticed two torpedos inbound. I had plenty of time to call that out to my squadmates, and we all evacuated right before they struck and went back to finish the cap. It was a T4 3v3 match. They never used a single 'ceptor, opting to rotate between Guards, Engineers, and 1 Command fighter. We managed to trounce them without losing a single ticket. (EDIT: My team ran CovertOps, ECM, and Engi).
I understand that this is not the norm, I just think we should attempt to adapt and overcome before raging. Just give it another week guys, and let’s see if someone doesn’t develop a viable strategy to break apart frigate balls with the tools we already have.
Got inst-gibbed by a frig torpedo earlier. Instead of getting angry I realized, “Welp, I probably shouldn’t have flown at that guy in a straight line.”
I went back for more and managed to stay under the frigate’s belly: problem solved.
or maybe he just ran out of torpedoes… hehe… you know you can fire them under your belly…
See next post.
Okay, so I decided to run a little test. I took my Machette that I had not added synergy to and did a series of tests to see the impact of modules on queue rank. I equipped only that ship in slot one.
What I found was startling:
-
Synergy doesn’t matter at all.
-
The primary weapon affects your queue rank number. If you equip a mk2 or mk3 it increases you in the queue rank number. So when I have nothing equipped in the primary slot I’m at rank 22, when I equip a Mk3 weapon I’m at rank 25.
-
The primary slot weapon of the first ship is (sometimes) the only that affects the queue. You can have Mk3 weapons on your ships in slot 2,3 & 4 and they do not affect the matchmaking.
This is frustrating because the game punishes you for buying a better weapon and tosses you up against stronger players. It is also a potential exploit in the opposite direction.
The forum doesn’t allow me to paste the spread sheet, so forgive me for the formatting below. A dash (-) means the slot is empty.
Tier/Rank/Ship/Syn/DSR/Primary Weapon/Ammo/Missile/AMod1/AMod2/PMod1/Queue Rank
2 4 Machette 1 1176 - - - TPm1 ESm1 - 22
2 4 Machette 1 1167 ARail Mk1 - Standard 1 TPm1 ESm1 Eguid 1 24
2 4 Machette 1 1167 ARail Mk3 - Standard 1 TPm1 ESm1 Eguid 1 25
2 4 Machette 1 1167 ARail Mk3 Ex Mk3 Standard Mk3 TPm1 ESm1 Elecguid 1 25
2 4 Machette 1 1167 ARail Mk3 Ex Mk3 Standard Mk3 TPMIL ESMIL Elecguidxp 25
2 4 Machette 1 1167 ARail Mk1 Ex Mk3 Standard Mk3 TPMIL ESMIL Elecguidxp 24
2 4 Machette 1 1167 - - Standard Mk3 TPMIL ESMIL Elecguidxp 23
2 4 Machette 1 1180 - - Standard Mk3 TPMIL ESMIL Elecguidxp 23
2 4 Machette 2 1180 - - Standard Mk3 TPMIL ESMIL Elecguidxp 23
2 4 Machette 3 1180 ARail Mk3 - Standard Mk3 TPMIL ESMIL Elecguidxp 25
2 4 Machette 4 1180 ARail Mk3 - Standard Mk3 TPMIL ESMIL Elecguidxp 25
2 4 Machette 4 1180 ARail Mk3 Ex Mk3 Standard Mk3 TPMIL ESMIL Elecguidxp 25
2 4 Machette 5 1180 ARail Mk3 Ex Mk3 Standard Mk3 TP MK3 ESMIL Elecguidxp 25
2 4 Machette 5 1170 ARail Mk3 Ex Mk3 Standard Mk3 TP MK3 ESMIL Elecguidxp 25
2 4 Machette 5 1170 - Ex Mk3 Standard Mk3 TP MK3 ESMIL Elecguidxp 24
2 4 Machette 6 1170 - Ex Mk3 Standard Mk3 TP MK3 ESMIL Elecguidxp 24
2 4 Machette 6 1170 ARail Mk3 Ex Mk3 Standard Mk3 TP MK3 ESMIL Elecguidxp 25
2 4 Machette 7 1170 ARail Mk3 Ex Mk3 Standard Mk3 TP MK3 ESMIL Elecguidxp 25
@betatrash going behind enemy and capping beacon as rocon is called tactics. If you feel useless not killing (I thought you quit already) that is your problem alone.
I rather cap a beacon and steal a win rather than getting maniac medal and lose.
@betatrash going behind enemy and capping beacon as rocon is called tactics. If you feel useless not killing (I thought you quit already) that is your problem alone.
I rather cap a beacon and steal a win rather than getting maniac medal and lose.
i agree, however, sitting at the beacon and not helping just beyond the front line, where this usually happens is what the problem is.
plus, 3-4 people will sit there and waste time just for those points… it leads to poor gameplay. easier than getting 3 kills for them, or 5 buff assists, or 4 damage assists.
solo capping as a recon doesn’t happen very often, vs an organized team… or you mean vs a lot of T1 randoms?
and depends on game mode, in beacon hunt, recon better, but vs organized team, doesn’t work…
in capture the beacons, covert ops. but also doesn’t work vs an organized team. and at most you can cap 1 beacon in this mode this way, since the other two are too close to each other and defensible. so it is irrelevant. plus, 1 beacon will usually not win you the game, considering the enemy can also take one of your beacons and usually does. so it doesn’t contribute much to the game.
i still say fix it… and the only mode in which it matters is beacon hunt (and only vs disorganized teams). so if you want, make a bonus for capping within 5-10 secs of beacon appearing.
it’s also bad for detonation… since you can do most of the work on your team in terms of protecting the bomb carrier, clearing the path, defending etc… but because you don’t pick up the bomb you lose efficiency… but if you pick up the bomb, you can’t kill people as you normally can… so you do nothing for your team really… it rewards bad gameplay.
this way, you’re getting more for kills and more for damage assists… and less for ‘beacon farming’ and assist farming…
- The primary slot weapon of the first ship is the one that affects the queue. You can have Mk3 weapons on your ships in slot 2,3 & 4 and they do not affect the matchmaking.
ah, so this is what people were exploiting. thanks for the info, time to get exploiting… err i mean ‘testing’…
you should only get an assist for command/engineer buffs if your teammate was less than 100% health 15 secs before the kill occurs… if they aren’t, you didn’t really assist anything :\
This is probably true, we’d have to ask the devs to confirm. Commands do yield easy assists in the right instances. To me bufs and debufs should scale based on actual use rather than if it was used.
plus, buff/debuff assists give too much eff compared to damage assists. you can mass farm them… 20/30 buff/debuff assists in a game easily = 1200-1800 efficiency… plus you kills and caps…
Debufs can be extremely effective. The only really effective buf would probably be the command’s weapon damage which is timed and not constant.
but the worst i thinki in terms of efficiency farming are beacon caps: 300 points… for doing almost nothing.
I’ve won matches based on beacon caps, it’s knowing the match and the rules of the game. There’s nothing wrong with it. Of course normally when I win by it, it’s a 3v3 or 4v4…with bots… It’s skill beyond kills.
you can have zero kills, zero assists, and end up with top score (almost), because your team is too busy killing people while you’re capping beacons behind the front lines… being as useless as ever.
Beacon capturers are by definition at the front lines.
for starters, raise kill points to 120, raise damage assists to 90, and buff/debuff may need to be lowered, but keep it the same for now. and lower beacon caps to 180 points.
Then you encourage people to kill rather than play objectives. The game isn’t set up to be a realistic combat recon without a captain.
singularity is OP. i consistently get more kills with that than any other fighter weapon.
I feel it’s OP only because of the AoE, nothing else. For an “anti-frigate” weapon, quite frankly if you can’t hit the broad side of a frigate with it you shouldn’t load it!
especially on tackler… just tackle and easy-button them to death… command kind of the same deal, pop shield an pummel target… assault is a bit trickier.
and interceptors are OP for several reason: they heal almost instantly around an engineer and speedtank on top of it, basically almost impossible to kill them around an engineer.
Live easy, die easy. Fed’s are OP in this regard, the speed helps a lot, and any recon, becuase it’s easier to avoid damage.
ecm disables and covert white noise are broken… they break almost every unit and not just the ones they are intended to counter.
ECM’s are defensive for xxxx’s sake! It almost always requires a double team to do a good kill. White noise is best as a “please don’t target me, I’m fragile” module more than anything else. Guess what, they still see you and shoot at you!
white noise prevents you from even seeing the target correctly due to the red flashing graphic… so you can hit with singularity and maybe some other junk… but sniping = moronic… so they break their natural counter: snipers… they also break tacklers which are another ‘supposed’ counter… they can hide from ecms with camo, then white noise them…
we don’t even need to discuss how ecms break everyhting as well… in fact, xxxx everything about ecms…
and no, im not ‘crying’ because i’m a ‘newb’… i’m saying i can use these units to the same effect… and they are ridiculously OP.
Go squadless or without squad communication. Then say they’re OP. I play ECM some, I’ve never feared ECM, ever.
recon is the only interceptor that is still somewhat balanced. shield transfer is still OP vs other inties… just like ecm energy absorber is… it drains your shields/cap completely to zero and keeps it there.
Except warping away to avoid a kill shot! An engineer can only jump 5km, but a recon can go 10km and still have high speed? Fifteen seconds and no kill because of backspace suicide? That’s OP! As for energy absorber, the only thing it does is fight engineers and help you regain energy for modules and afterburners.
the problem is that these skills, and heal skills, etc heal/drain the same amount of inties and frigates… but they should have a larger effect on frigs…
oversight in game design basically… same goes for AOE damage… more damage to frigs, less to inties.
btw, you’re not a ‘veteran’… just saying…
It’s all a matter of true balance.
This is probably true, we’d have to ask the devs to confirm. Commands do yield easy assists in the right instances. To me bufs and debufs should scale based on actual use rather than if it was used.
Debufs can be extremely effective. The only really effective buf would probably be the command’s weapon damage which is timed and not constant.
I’ve won matches based on beacon caps, it’s knowing the match and the rules of the game. There’s nothing wrong with it. Of course normally when I win by it, it’s a 3v3 or 4v4…with bots… It’s skill beyond kills.
Beacon capturers are by definition at the front lines.
I feel it’s OP only because of the AoE, nothing else. For an “anti-frigate” weapon, quite frankly if you can’t hit the broad side of a frigate with it you shouldn’t load it!
ECM’s are defensive for xxxx’s sake! It almost always requires a double team to do a good kill. White noise is best as a “please don’t target me, I’m fragile” module more than anything else. Guess what, they still see you and shoot at you!
Go squadless or without squad communication. Then say they’re OP. I play ECM some, I’ve never feared ECM, ever.
Except warping away to avoid a kill shot! An engineer can only jump 5km, but a recon can go 10km and still have high speed? Fifteen seconds and no kill because of backspace suicide? That’s OP! As for energy absorber, the only thing it does is fight engineers and help you regain energy for modules and afterburners.
having 5-6 commands that all get buff assists leads to poor gameplay. assist farming basically.
debuffs should only be worth 1/2-2/3 of a damage assist, dmg assists worth 3/4 or 4/5 of a kill. prevents assist farming and killstealing.
who hasn’t won matches based on beacon caps? the point is, they shouldn’t provide 3 times as much points to every single person capping… that’s… ridiculous… it’s farming…
no, the front lines are usually in front of the beacon. intercept the enemy before they have time to organize and attack… otherwise, you’re wasting strategic opportunity. not to mention allowing the enemy to get within capping range.
yes, singularity is mainly OP because of the AOE.
ecms are not defensive (although they can be used that way), they are used to setup spikes… disable a target, it pops in 3 seconds… nothing you can do about it… because… iddqd that’s why…
well then you don’t fear ecm at your peril, because i can take down any inty and most fighters with a single disable and just shooting them with guns+missiles… if need be, use statis = guaranteed kill in most cases, unless they’ve used a survival module in the last 10 secs (R8 implant required), still allows them to move. but that’s a situational counter.
no, energy absorber will prevent you from afterburning, and using almost all active modules… it’s basically yet another disable on top of statis and emitter… ie: inties have 50-75 energy regen? absorber removes 200+?.. basically helpless… that’s what you become ;p it’s a disable. engineers on the other hand can get 200+. not to mention this single skill shuts down commands: prevents them from using active buffs and drains the phase shield. turning them into a toothless fighter, with a gun and nothing else…
i agree, however, sitting at the beacon and not helping just beyond the front line, where this usually happens is what the problem is.
plus, 3-4 people will sit there and waste time just for those points… it leads to poor gameplay. easier than getting 3 kills for them, or 5 buff assists, or 4 damage assists.
It’s called playing for objectives, for the win.
solo capping as a recon doesn’t happen very often, vs an organized team… or you mean vs a lot of T1 randoms?
and depends on game mode, in beacon hunt, recon better, but vs organized team, doesn’t work…
in capture the beacons, covert ops. but also doesn’t work vs an organized team. and at most you can cap 1 beacon in this mode this way, since the other two are too close to each other and defensible. so it is irrelevant. plus, 1 beacon will usually not win you the game, considering the enemy can also take one of your beacons and usually does. so it doesn’t contribute much to the game.
i still say fix it… and the only mode in which it matters is beacon hunt (and only vs disorganized teams). so if you want, make a bonus for capping within 5-10 secs of beacon appearing.
That could require interceptors. A change like that would have to count the fact that the enemy may charge in, and affect the beacon capture process.
it’s also bad for detonation… since you can do most of the work on your team in terms of protecting the bomb carrier, clearing the path, defending etc… but because you don’t pick up the bomb you lose efficiency… but if you pick up the bomb, you can’t kill people as you normally can… so you do nothing for your team really… it rewards bad gameplay.
Protecting a bomb carrier is not rewarded by points, I’ll agree and request a change because it’s a valuable purpose. First dibs is first dibs, you can kill, it just depends on your objective. If my ship isn’t a “bomb carrier” but I get the bomb then I’m holding and/or killing. Holding currently helps. That’s only at end game, otherwise I’ll drop the bomb or avoid the bomb while protecting it.
this way, you’re getting more for kills and more for damage assists… and less for ‘beacon farming’ and assist farming…
having 5-6 commands that all get buff assists leads to poor gameplay. assist farming basically.
Only if they’re farming and not killing. “Valkyrie” cane help a team a lot when you know when to use it.
debuffs should only be worth 2/3 of a damage assist, kills worth 3/4 or 4/5 of a kill. prevents assist farming and killstealing.
Debufs should depend on timing. If someone’s rushing the captain, a debuf stops their damage. If you know someone’s almost dead, a stasis secures the kill. As for commands shield and hull bufs, those are easy, as are engineers. An engineer’s/command’s bufs “should” only depend on survivability of the targeting ship. But if that were the case those modules would not be loaded even though they would help the team to victory. That’s why it should be scaled, not fixed.
who hasn’t won matches based on beacon caps? the point is, they shouldn’t provide 3 times as much points to every single person capping… that’s… ridiculous… it’s farming…
It’s knowing gameplay. If you know the rules to win, you use them. Baseball isn’t all about home runs.
no, the front lines are usually in front of the beacon. intercept the enemy before they have time to organize and attack… otherwise, you’re wasting strategic opportunity.
Behind the target tends to be safer, if you’re in from, then a “lock onto nearest target” will target you. It’s especially true in combat recon where the captain falls back, then you should stay behind him just to make it easier to lock onto the attacker. But capturing the beacon is part of the win! The initial capture gets more points than the secondary capture! Know the map, know the game. That’s true skill.
yes, singularity is mainly OP because of the AOE.
…I want to reply, but you’re agreeing…
ecms are not defensive (although they can be used that way), they are used to setup spikes… disable a target, it pops in 3 seconds… nothing you can do about it… because… iddqd that’s why…
Then why do they die? Why aren’t they abused? The only time it’s offensive is when they’re already targeted and it’s stasis! Ion Emitter prevents active module and weapons like nukes or attacking vital targets. Energy absorber helps stop active modules from being start ed, afterburners, or to regain energy to use active modules or afterburners. Stasis has the purpose of easy targeting for your TEAM and avoiding a bomb plant or bomb capture. The active module part is secondary. Weapon System Inhibitor, well what about everyone else? It’s localized to one target and only if he’s firing!
well then you don’t fear ecm at your peril, because i can take down any inty and most fighters with a single disable and just shooting them with guns+missiles… if need be, use statis = guaranteed kill in most cases, unless they’ve used a survival module in the last 10 secs, still allows them to move. but that’s a situational counter.
It’s always situational, does your team support you? It matters for every ship! Unless you’re a gunship, those things are brutal on guards…
no, energy absorber will prevent you from afterburning, and using almost all active modules… it’s basically yet another disable on top of statis and emitter…
Except weapons are fired like normal kills, and missiles are still fired like normal kills. The only thing that isn’t normal is that you’re reduced to a ship without "magic."
