Yes, GS prices are intentionally absurd and are not actually meant to be bought (it would be P2W, right?), but it still happened I accidentally clicked on a GS option instead of loyalty when upgrading in T5, lost 2.400 GS. Can I get a refund for that, btw?
Again, what exactly makes you think people actually want to move from T3?
T4 offers nothing different gameplay wise than r8 T3 except increased prices of everything from gear to repairs (oh and one or two new passive mods, woo).
T3 has reasonable prices and is populated, there is no reason to leave
Pretty much. Long ago people refused to move out of T2, then repair costs were rebalanced and made T3 the sweet spot. Suppose it stays that way despite the current loyalty grind because so many had full blue T3 from before the change and thus can remain competitive there without having to pay real money for modules.
The problem with everything on this game is grinding everywhere.
Lets check this out to see if its true:
I wanna buy the first T5 ship for example, costs almost 8 million. If i dont have any DLC and no license, ill earn about 250k each PVE. IF no PVE run fails, ill have to do about 32 battles just to buy the hull, fitted horribly. Then, lets supose we need to change all the modules, i think we would have to pay aprox the same value as the ship itself, so, another 32 PVE battles. But we also want them at least MK2 so we are not SOOOOOOOOOOO crushed but ppl with blues and purples, and there goes anoter 32 battles, if not more.
Since the only contract we can do on PVE is WIN A BATTLE, we would have gathered also 57600 loyalty. In a TOTAL of 96 PVE battles. IF we have a good group, and finish that AT LEAST in 10 mins, it would requipre 16 hours straight playing the most boring thing ever created by mankind just to buy 1 ship and fit it will all MK2 modules, IMAGINE DOING THAT FOR 4 SHIPS!!! I personally cant do more than 1 PVE mission before i feel the need to throw up. Which means, MASSIVE ULTRA BORING CREDITS GRIND.
For vouchers, i don’t know how much each module costs to upgrade on T5, but i imagine it is a vast quantity, and if your aim is to farm those, you will not have fun in PVP either, because you will have to focus on fullfiling the contracts objectives to get a ridiculously low amount of vouchers, so, in a week or more, you can buy 1 module. After that, rinse and repeat until your brain stops working… Again, a MASSIVE ULTRA BORING CREDS GRIND. And the worst part is, you cant do this, and the previous grind simultaneously unless you want to increase vastly the creds grind via the PVP’s long waiting queues.
Artifacts are easyer ppl say, on T4 and T5, so i will not argue.
Now, you bought the ship, you fitted it with MK2 or already MK3-4 and you set off to synergyse your ship… EXTREME LONG WAITS for a battle. And when you start a battle, theres a HUGE chance you will face an entire team from the same corp and be obliterated, and get little to no synergy, Which will force the weak hearts to retreat to T3 or T2, or, the most patient yet, will take that shiny powerfull ship, and GRIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIND synergy on PVE aswell. And there goes another billion battles to synergyse it.
I’d say the 6 months that i think JPhack said, was a bit generous. Normal players, casual players (that make up for the majority of players) dont like being crushed over and over, and dont like to spend 10 months to get 1 ship to a good stats, and the Devs seems to be blind, and deaf about it.
Ive met some new players saying:> DUDE THIS GAME IS AWESOME, i ask, what tier are you playing? Tier 2, i say, nice, join the corp, and then we say, try to get to T3, so we can do some dammage. After 2 weeks, the dude goes offline and never comes back again to play… I would say it was because of the grind, but, the devs seems to know more than us the players, so, they should tell us…
We need some INCENTIVE for people to move up to T4/5
Well, there is some incentive to get up to T4/5: Sector Conquest.
But its not enough. To be honest, besides the GS Sectors, all other sectors are not worth it.
Just look at the Artifact-Sectors: You get about 40 in the whole cycle time? Thats pretty much 1-2 Rounds in PvE: Estimated time: 15 mins?
Same amount in SecCon: (Estimated bid 40 pts) makes 10 Matches for a 4-man squad. Estimated time: 2-4 hours (given that they win every battle)
Same counts for Credit sectors. While i still agree that sectors shouldnt be like the “fat get fatter” there should be a buff for at least 50% regarding the Credit/Artifact sectors.
Still, the all-too-clear imbalances in SecCon (it just cant work that way, best way would be to split it tier-wise etc…) are not really encouraging for new players. They might do this a few times, get roflstomped and leave the game or go back to T3 which is the last tier where the world seems to be OK.
T4+ Matchmaking is due to the lack of players abysmal : Waiting times, unbalanced matches etc. Also R10 ships are as bad in T4 as the R7s in T3. They feel bad, they have heavy stat problems. So its all the painful grind again.
Squadding in a 3 man Squad up there is pretty much pointless, you can expect at least a waiting time of 15mins+
If you go there in a 2-man-squad you have to 75% a bad experience, because the MM forces you to have the brainless in your team (2 good skilled players cant win with 2+ braintards vs an average team… well, you can but it forces you to fly specific ships/types of ships over and over again… you cant synergize the “not so popular” classes without having a granted loose)
The tier-rushers dont care on the other hand, they seem to have a brain- and pain-off-switch and they just grind like automatons (in a weird way this is something to respect) but ruin the matches for the vets -or better- “thinking” players.
I still think the reputation-mechanic was the superior one, but it would make the whole synergy grind obsolete. The playerbase is too small, the MM cant work as intended due to that. The grind is too high (real progression) and too low (tier rushers) on the other side for newcomers.
Much to do. And at the current state there is no easy solution.
Yes, GS prices are intentionally absurd and are not actually meant to be bought (it would be P2W, right?), but it still happened I accidentally clicked on a GS option instead of loyalty when upgrading in T5, lost 2.400 GS. Can I get a refund for that, btw?
I doubt you can…
There we figured it out.
END THE GRIND
LESSEN THE GRIND
DO SOMETHING TO MAKE IT NOT BORING TO PLAY!
just last night I solo Q’ed T4/5
I got 3 matches with the same guy. Needless to say we both decided to farm bots and trade wins all for the sake of A. Gaining better stats. B. Make games last longer to gain at least 10K synergy. and C. become good friends.
I understand your frustration, Kraimax, but please take this into notice:
I played 3000 games to get my T5s, and 4000 games to get my T5s purple fitted.
This was 4000 games with license and all DLCs from day one. In times when it was easier to obtain certain modules and easier to farm. Now calculate how long would take without license.
It is not intended for anyone to fly T5 so soon. This is a reward for players, that have been playing this game a lot, and for a long time.
We played so many T2 and T3 games before I started entering higher tiers, I lost count. And i never even bothered with PVE much, it was all about the loyalty for the blues.
So there is no reason in complaining. Having a T5 ship will not make you a better pilot. Focus on improving your skills and enjoying the game instead.
I understand your frustration, Kraimax, but please take this into notice:
I played 3000 games to get my T5s, and 4000 games to get my T5s purple fitted.
This was 4000 games with license and all DLCs from day one. In times when it was easier to obtain certain modules and easier to farm. Now calculate how long would take without license.
It is not intended for anyone to fly T5 so soon. This is a reward for players, that have been playing this game a lot, and for a long time.
We played so many T2 and T3 games before I started entering higher tiers, I lost count. And i never even bothered with PVE much, it was all about the loyalty for the blues.
So there is no reason in complaining. Having a T5 ship will not make you a better pilot. Focus on improving your skills and enjoying the game instead.
Like how you and me cant kill each other in a dogfighting grudge match for 10 minutes…
Like how you and me cant kill each other in a dogfighting grudge match for 10 minutes…
Exactly. It was the same across all tiers.
All in all, T3 is still where most of the action is, and where I like to play myself as well, because it’s just more fun.
T5s are just a novelty, a vanity, a reward for your long playtime and something nice to look at the hangar. A tool for PVE farming, so you can farm better items, to… farm PVE better. And do occasional stomp in SQ once a day, so you can feel good about your achievement and actually have some use from them, otherwise they are just hangar decorations.
Exactly. It was the same across all tiers.
All in all, T3 is still where most of the action is, and where I like to play myself as well, because it’s just more fun. T5s are just a novelty, a vanity, a reward for your long playtime and something nice to look at the hangar.
I think Im gonna fully make my T3 inty purple. Its useless to have 700+ artifacts sitting there for nothing!
And besides, 1 v 1 in PVP does not work in some game modes.
Exactly. It was the same across all tiers.
All in all, T3 is still where most of the action is, and where I like to play myself as well, because it’s just more fun. T5s are just a novelty, a vanity, a reward for your long playtime and something nice to look at the hangar.
Even T3 is deteriorating, i think there are more ppl on T2 currently. At least on the times i play, queues in T3 sometimes takes 5 mins or more, while T2 almost never reaches 5 mins.
Even T3 is deteriorating, i think there are more ppl on T2 currently. At least on the times i play, queues in T3 sometimes takes 5 mins or more, while T2 almost never reaches 5 mins.
Because of the part of the biggest bottleneck of the game. Loyalty vouchers. Which nearly double the amount to get blues in T4/5, making it an unreasonable grind for new players. Thats why they stick to T3.
I remember when I first started this game, progression was not an issue, and I would go through the ranks like it was nothing because of 2 things. It was FUN and I was good at the game.
Because of the part of the biggest bottleneck of the game. Loyalty vouchers. Which nearly double the amount to get blues in T4/5, making it an unreasonable grind for new players. Thats why they stick to T3.
On the other hand, if you dont advance to the top rank, you dont get all contracts.
T5s are just a novelty, a vanity, a reward for your long playtime and something nice to look at the hangar. A tool for PVE farming, so you can farm better items, to… farm PVE better. And do occasional stomp in SQ once a day, so you can feel good about your achievement and actually have some use from them, otherwise they are just hangar decorations.
And thats a shame, imo. there are still imbalances in the T5 ships. Just think about the bad fish (Piranha)… or the Viking (at lower lvls)
The problem with everything on this game is grinding everywhere.
Lets check this out to see if its true:
I wanna buy the first T5 ship for example, costs almost 8 million. If i dont have any DLC and no license, ill earn about 250k each PVE. IF no PVE run fails, ill have to do about 32 battles just to buy the hull, fitted horribly. Then, lets supose we need to change all the modules, i think we would have to pay aprox the same value as the ship itself, so, another 32 PVE battles. But we also want them at least MK2 so we are not SOOOOOOOOOOO crushed but ppl with blues and purples, and there goes anoter 32 battles, if not more.
Since the only contract we can do on PVE is WIN A BATTLE, we would have gathered also 57600 loyalty. In a TOTAL of 96 PVE battles. IF we have a good group, and finish that AT LEAST in 10 mins, it would requipre 16 hours straight playing the most boring thing ever created by mankind just to buy 1 ship and fit it will all MK2 modules, IMAGINE DOING THAT FOR 4 SHIPS!!! I personally cant do more than 1 PVE mission before i feel the need to throw up. Which means, MASSIVE ULTRA BORING CREDITS GRIND.
For vouchers, i don’t know how much each module costs to upgrade on T5, but i imagine it is a vast quantity, and if your aim is to farm those, you will not have fun in PVP either, because you will have to focus on fullfiling the contracts objectives to get a ridiculously low amount of vouchers, so, in a week or more, you can buy 1 module. After that, rinse and repeat until your brain stops working… Again, a MASSIVE ULTRA BORING CREDS GRIND. And the worst part is, you cant do this, and the previous grind simultaneously unless you want to increase vastly the creds grind via the PVP’s long waiting queues.
Artifacts are easyer ppl say, on T4 and T5, so i will not argue.
Now, you bought the ship, you fitted it with MK2 or already MK3-4 and you set off to synergyse your ship… EXTREME LONG WAITS for a battle. And when you start a battle, theres a HUGE chance you will face an entire team from the same corp and be obliterated, and get little to no synergy, Which will force the weak hearts to retreat to T3 or T2, or, the most patient yet, will take that shiny powerfull ship, and GRIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIND synergy on PVE aswell. And there goes another billion battles to synergyse it.
I’d say the 6 months that i think JPhack said, was a bit generous. Normal players, casual players (that make up for the majority of players) dont like being crushed over and over, and dont like to spend 10 months to get 1 ship to a good stats, and the Devs seems to be blind, and deaf about it.
Ive met some new players saying:> DUDE THIS GAME IS AWESOME, i ask, what tier are you playing? Tier 2, i say, nice, join the corp, and then we say, try to get to T3, so we can do some dammage. After 2 weeks, the dude goes offline and never comes back again to play… I would say it was because of the grind, but, the devs seems to know more than us the players, so, they should tell us…
Sorry but you can farm many vouchers in pve. Survival ones, beacon ones, efficiency ones, win ones and I have yet to test if you can also farm the beacon protect ones.
I have been playing since October nd currently i have 67 ships purchased, all tier 1 and tier 2 elited, all empire tier 3 purple except ecm ceptors and long range, and i have 4 tier 4 ships with green modules and some blues, the only reason I don’t have more is because there are few people playing tier 4.
The grind is not horrible. In fact, it is better than warthunder.
On the other hand, if you dont advance to the top rank, you dont get all contracts.
Well crap, that makes it 10 times worst.
best idea in the world. REMOVE THE CONTRACT COOL DOWNS!
You still have to have a match and complete your objective which still takes time, so it wont be such a grind!
Or just halve the requirements to get MK3s…
Sorry but you can farm many vouchers in pve. Survival ones, beacon ones, efficiency ones, win ones and I have yet to test if you can also farm the beacon protect ones.
I have been playing since October nd currently i have 67 ships purchased, all tier 1 and tier 2 elited, all empire tier 3 purple except ecm ceptors and long range, and i have 4 tier 4 ships with green modules and some blues, the only reason I don’t have more is because there are few people playing tier 4.
The grind is not horrible. In fact, it is better than warthunder.
I dare you to spend the time in a new account and go from T1 to T3…
Warthunder is still pretty high…so thats not saying much
Or just halve the requirements to get MK3s…
For starters requirements * 0,75 should be sufficient.
“Too few players” is biggest issue in this game currently. It means that release time is starting to get close. Good.
“Grinding” is part of the free-to-play business model. Companies eat money. I can confirm that loyalty is definitely biggest grind there is, but I do like to point out, that you can play the game with Mk1 and Mk2 modules. Vouchers are not obligatory to proceed, like Synergy and Credits are.
“Too few players” is biggest issue in this game currently. It means that release time is starting to get close. Good.
“Grinding” is part of the free-to-play business model. Companies eat money. I can confirm that loyalty is definitely biggest grind there is, but I do like to point out, that you can play the game with Mk1 and Mk2 modules. Vouchers are not obligatory to proceed, like Synergy and Credits are.
True, but large corporations or highly competitive ones require it. No point of playing T4/5 if you want to be curbstomped by those with more powerful weapons and modules.
Sure its doable, but harder on you and hurts your team when you cant kill an enemy, but could of killed them with blue or purple.