(most) Debuffs are not fun

A constant source of frustration for me on Star Conflict are the debuffs. I was going to go through them one by one but I can never remember their names, so instead I’m going to go over key point as to what makes a debuff annoying, and what makes them fine in my eyes.


First and foremost, a debuff should never unplug my keyboard. If I can’t do anything to counter the debuff, it should not be in the game. No ability should have zero counters.


Biggest offender here, bar none, is the ECM. Being knocked out of action for a second because of their field ability is frustrating, but having all my weapons and modules shut down for ten seconds is unforgivable.


The White Noise Generator is a close second in this field; disabling the aiming system is something I don’t have a problem with because there are counters to that. You can still use lasers, or any other gun if your aim is good enough, and most abilities that prevent lock-on stop the user from firing. White Noise does not. It not only knocks out targeting, but it also means you cannot use missiles or any module that requires a lock-on. In short, you’re under attack from an enemy who has all but stopped you from fighting back.


That is not the point of a debuff. Not by a long shot. If you want to stop someone fighting back then you should either kill them, or beat them so hard they run for their lives. Having the ability to say “you’re not allowed to play any more” with the touch of a button is wrong.


Debuffs, perhaps more than any other aspect of play, need to provide good and satisfying counter-play. The tackler’s debuffs, both their speed reduction and resistance reduction, offer counter-play options because their activation range is only medium and they require line of sight. There are ways to beat that - you can run, hide or simply kill the Tackler.


ECMs in particular give you no options. You can’t fight back because they’ve deactivated your weapons. You can’t counter them with modules because they’ve deactivated your modules. You can’t use your Special because, surprise surprise, that’s deactivated too. Your option left is to run, and Interceptors are the fastest ships in the game so you can never outrun them.


This is terrible game design. Flat out, unforgivably short-sighted, terrible game design.


Debuffs need counters, and the counter needs to be something more meaningful than “lol just nuke them before they get in range!”


Proposed Solutions:

  1. Debuffs that alter stats (ie: reduced resistance) do not need to change for the most part.
  2. No debuff should prevent a player from shooting. Ever.
  3. No debuff should prevent a player from moving. Ever. Slowing them down is fine, but immobilising them is not.
  4. White Noise should not prevent the player from locking on - it should simply remove the aim assist reticule and prevent homing missiles from locking on. This leaves sufficient counter-play options open to the victim - they can fire blind, use dumbfire ordnance or activate a module. 
  5. Debuffs that deactivate modules need to be applied with far greater care. A lot of ships lose all of their functionality and/or become stupidly vulnerable when their active slots are denied to them. As a test, I would suggest that the ECM’s Ion Emitter have its duration removed - it simply turns off every active module on the target ship. Since most active modules take a few seconds to reactivate, this is still a potentially useful debuff.

Ofcourse debuffs aren’t fun when used against you, that is their purpose!

Debuffs are fine for me, only the spy drones could use a time-lasting nerf, 2 minutes is too much…


All the other debuffs are short lasting and have no large impact generally.

You do not like the “ions Warheads”?


But it’s funny to spam on engineer: D

See her get disintegrate without any reaction. (Or no action possible).


Welcome to my world! “FLYING POTATO CONFLICT”.


Especially when you’ve got the squad decides to focus fire with a rotation of missiles.




You spoke of the ECM? sorry


The “proton wall” and implant jericho are useless. It does not prevent spam controls let alone the fact that all modules, weapons and smallest defensive system are broken.


There are no diminishing returns on controls; does not surprise me that there was spam.


Any ship can be a ECM view that there is no restriction on the Warheads ions.


Besides, why the missile has the same effect as “Stasis Generator”?


@ JQ - this conflicts with your being in favor of hard counters.


I was about to flame, supporting the idea that ECM should be made stronger as an effective counter against heal squads. But

kept on reading and it seems your opinion does not contradict mine so - cool.



I would suggest that the ECM’s Ion Emitter have its duration removed - it simply turns off every active module on the target ship. Since most active modules take a few seconds to reactivate, this is still a potentially useful debuff.


  • then activation cost must be revised. healers are already enjoying cheap energy use. as is, energy deprivation is ineffective currently to prevent remote heal activation. because of this, the duration block on ions have value despite being ineffectually short. duration removal = buff energy attrition.


other than that, all good.

Being on the receiving end of any ECM is a nightmare. You cannot. Do. Anything. To kill it.



You can always run :slight_smile:

You can always run :slight_smile:

May I remind you that we are talking about interceptors. Outrunning them is out of the question, unless you’re a fed cov ops or recon.

Ion warheads are something that I disagree on as well. I disagree with most ‘missiles’ once you get to Tier 2 and up, because it seems all you get is mine spam, nukes and ion.


You are right, Kine, that I do like hard counter classes. The problem is that, as ECM tech works at present, it hard counters everyone. Honestly, who here actually cares about being locked by a Tackler? Interceptors, and nobody else. Commands know their resistance buffs and Diffusion will let them tank the Tankler; Gunships have the raw DPS to swat them out of the sky, and Frigates are already slow moving weapon platforms who don’t care about that debuff. All a Tackler can really do against non-Interceptors is support someone else in making the kill.


An ECM can shut down anyone and everyone. Every class gets hurt by having their guns shut off. Every class gets hurt by losing access to their modules. That is technically a Hard Counter, but it’s not directed at anyone; a properly designed Hard Counter class should be very strong against a specific type of enemy.


…actually, I have an idea… I’m going to give it its own thread though.

Ion warheads are something that I disagree on as well


I spammed them on you this morning :smiley: Sorry…


The thing with tackler is they are really good as Target Designator.


The debuff are powerfull to easily destroy a focused target, but people prefer to play it as a ninja ship.

That ion spam is a prime example of the problem. Frankly, it’s not fun to be on the receiving end of.


It might sound odd, but it is “fun”, from a certain point of view, to be hit by debuffs like the Tackler’s resistance debuff. As I mentioned, there are counters to that. That’s where the fun comes from - having to find and apply a solution. There is no solution to ion spam or ECM abilities. It’s why plasma arc also gets so much flak - there is no counter.


Most things a Fighter or Frigate can do can be countered. Interceptors cause problems because they’re too fast and can perform run-by attacks. But the bigger ships? Not so much. It’s only when they clump up into Frigate Balls problems start. But look at lone ships a moment…


Long Range:

How do you counter them? Send an Interceptor to maul them, or sneak up in a Tackler. You can use your own LRs to counter-snipe, or if all else fails you can stack thermal resists and keep to cover. Indeed, these counters work so well that, in tier 2 in particular, there is a commonly held belief that the side with the most LR frigates loses by default.



Guards are slow, and that lack of speed is the core of pretty much every counter-play. Pulsars? Engage from range or kite back and/or into cover after it activates so its wasted. Weapon / speed reduction? Engage from range again, or take a ship with huge DPS and overwhelm it. Sneak up on it from behind and it’ll have a very bad day…



Life expectancy of an Engineer in the open is very low indeed. Getting up close and violent is always a great way to deal with them, but missiles / mines are the optimal counter to their healing drones. Alternatively, you can counter their healing by debuffs - recon drones and tacklers will both help there.


There are counters to these ships, and there are (or should be) enough counters that there are interesting options on how to beat them. Currently, no such counters exist to the ECM, or to the mass of ion spam (the latter can be shut down with enough Guards, but still).