Module Idea: Reflective Armor

Suggestions PvP
1

Module availability: T3 or higher

Slot: Hull

Basic parameters:

 - adds half of thermal insulation in thermal resist (hull only)

 - if ship speed is at adaptive speed it increases main weapon damage output by partial incoming damage (boost in some percentages)

 

 * balance details are up to the devs, however it is meant to be only a slight damage boost;

 * it could take the damage value which is actually applied and add it as partial percentage boost in the next tick; this means, your resistance actually naturally nerfs the damage output, while your damage output is increased while you are under focus fire.

 * great for offensive and aggressive fits, or “bringing down someone”. Best used for alpha strikes, or the good old nub-facetanking, or juggernaut-guard.

 * thermal resistance always applies, so at least its half a thermal insulation.

 * does not give u much if you are a standing target, or nobody shoots you.

 * might make the decision whom to focus fire a bit more interesting.

 * buff/boost only applies to main weapon damage.

 

Some people prefer a story background to describe the module and understand it.

Adaptive effects have been greatly used by the Federation in combination with their strong engines, and got only a very late attention by the Empire, because of their strong emphasis on sophisticated armor.

While thermal insulation methods have been researched more aggressively in the last years, the biggest obstacle was always what to do with the heat itself, how to disippate it. The same effects that could be used to power structural integrity and shield resistance with an adaptive device, however, seemed practical in leading the overheat directly in to the power supply of weapon turrets, by secondary effects. While such a device could not reach the same heat resistance when installed into the armor systems of a ship, losing battles could result in more cautious enemies, if the weapons reflected parts of the incoming devastation back at its source.

 

Just an idea for a new module. Might be complete crap, but what ya think? Would that be OP? Or completely useless?

2

Seems a bit game-breaking since there are no downsides to using this.

3

it should be a normal module instead of in hull and should also be like the guard frigate thing that only works on a certain type of damage. i hope you get what i mean, like where repair kit goes. multipurpose module? :) 

4

the idea was more inspired by cruise engines, and the adaptive shield for shield slots.

having adaptive shielding is a defensive module, having adaptive hull (reflective armor) therefore an offensive one;

The idea about 50% thermal resistance of a thermal module would make it easier to fit it without sacrificing too much, but not as powerful as other hull resistance modules. It would benefit anything that tries to attack on high speeds.

The downsides of that strategy are self limiting: moving into the direction of the enemy at full speed. Guards have sometimes one hull slot, so they would still benefit from it, however it would not close their kinetic hole.

5

Seems a bit game-breaking since there are no downsides to using this.

passive modules often have no downsides, the downsides is being adaptive to be able to use it, and sacrificing a much needed hull slot; much like adaptive shielding is for shields. being a temporary passive bonus, see above post.

the gain should be minimal, but increase alpha damage in the attack; maybe it should be restricted to fighters and frigates only, to keep perma adaptive interceptors from gaining a permanent bonus; however since its based on damage which is incoming, possibly after the resistance, the gain of damage would be coinciding with being damaged.

I think the greatest downside might be, that the module mechanic is more complicated. But actually, it’s similar to the energy recuperation and adaptive shield combined with the guard shield.

6

Seems a bit game-breaking since there are no downsides to using this.

Just like there are no downsides to using Adaptive Shield? Or Vernier?

7

passive modules often have no downsides, the downsides is being adaptive to be able to use it, and sacrificing a much needed hull slot; much like adaptive shielding is for shields. being a temporary passive bonus, see above post.

the gain should be minimal, but increase alpha damage in the attack; maybe it should be restricted to fighters and frigates only, to keep perma adaptive interceptors from gaining a permanent bonus; however since its based on damage which is incoming, possibly after the resistance, the gain of damage would be coinciding with being damaged.

I think the greatest downside might be, that the module mechanic is more complicated. But actually, it’s similar to the energy recuperation and adaptive shield combined with the guard shield.

 

I just see Bubblewolves, tigers, and piranhas becoming even more powerful than they already are.  They can be brought down by engine/capacitor debufs, of course, easily, but with this they would get the extra edge outside of that.  Plus, combat reboot could make it more difficult for those classes to bring down this type of gunship.

8

yes but their strength comes also with adaptive + galvanized imho, something which is reduced if you cant just fit it

 

you are of course right tho.

9

yes but their strength comes also with adaptive + galvanized imho, something which is reduced if you cant just fit it

 

That’s a very good point…but since most would choose the R1 fed implant to take reduced explosion damage, they would just change to the Jericho implant to compensate for the lost galvanized armor.  I don’t think it’s as much, but it’s a possibility.

 

Plus, they would likely use the strafe implant, too since roll is not much of an issue w/o galva.

10

What happens if you stack this module on a ship with 3 hull slots?

 

For instance, a Cruise Engine Empire Gunship…

11

Then you are still kind of slow and may be unstable, because you fly empire, have a good thermal resist and standard em resist, get additional damage while you die relatively fast for an empire gunship

 

since you might want to get damage to activate the module, while flying full ab, combined with the insane damage you can output in an empire gunship, that thing might be like a one way killing machine, which instapops once ecmd or tackled

 

as i wrote this suggestion, the cruise madness was still not a hype - so I don’t ultimately see this as a viable idea right now. I still like the speedwolfm in T3, with the gameplay it offers, something which works well in T3, but ends in non stop troll in T5.

 

I think in T3 this item might be nice for some ships, or builds, but ultimately I grew apart from the idea myself; still maybe something for future inspiration. Not that I wouldn’t use it, if it would be present.

12

I like the idea for the module a lot, but speedy ships don’t really need any more advantage imo.  When flying at full speed, they already are pretty tough and survivable with adaptives, and giving them more damage is overkill.  We would see even more tacklers and ecm in order to try to stop this. 

 

Maybe make this module for t4+ frigs, and so where you can’t be flying higher than your max speed?  idk.  Frigs in higher tier games seem a little underpowered atm.

13

I like the idea for the module a lot, but speedy ships don’t really need any more advantage imo.  When flying at full speed, they already are pretty tough and survivable with adaptives, and giving them more damage is overkill.  We would see even more tacklers and ecm in order to try to stop this. 

 

Maybe make this module for t4+ frigs, and so where you can’t be flying higher than your max speed?  idk.  Frigs in higher tier games seem a little underpowered atm.

 

What he is saying is that you lose the galvanized armour for increased damage and half of the thermal resists of the normal module. So without a galvanized armour, the ships ARE much less tanky, but they do get other benefits without it.  As I pointed out, an implant can compensate somewhat for the lack of galva.

14

What he is saying is that you lose the galvanized armour for increased damage and half of the thermal resists of the normal module. So without a galvanized armour, the ships ARE much less tanky, but they do get other benefits without it.  As I pointed out, an implant can compensate somewhat for the lack of galva.

 

Oh, so can you not fit just galvanized or does it apply to all other armor resists as well?  Original post was worded a bit confusingly for me.  I guess it depends on the amount of extra damage it would provide too.

15

Alright, here’s another possible abuse.

 

Lion Mk2 or Paranha B2.

 

Cruise Engines, 2x Reflective Armor, 2x Adaptive Shields, Emergency Barrier.

16

Alright, here’s another possible abuse.

 

Lion Mk2 or Paranha B2.

 

Cruise Engines, 2x Reflective Armor, 2x Adaptive Shields, Emergency Barrier.

what a waste of a lion 2. that thing is meant as a stand off weapon, you shouldnt get within 2k if you play it right, which means speed tanking is a waste

17

what a waste of a lion 2. that thing is meant as a stand off weapon, you shouldnt get within 2k if you play it right, which means speed tanking is a waste

Lion Mk2 or Paranha B2.

18

yeah, it does make sense on a fed gunship

19

Alright, here’s another possible abuse.

 

Lion Mk2 or Paranha B2.

 

Cruise Engines, 2x Reflective Armor, 2x Adaptive Shields, Emergency Barrier.

 why abuse?

 

the problem with current speedtackling is not their fighting power, but their nonstop drone pooping.

 

also, i can’t really follow this:

 

When flying at full speed, they already are pretty tough and survivable with adaptives, and giving them more damage is overkill.  We would see even more tacklers and ecm in order to try to stop this.

 

as i wrote this, t5 cruise engines were still not there, and i was assuming, cruise would stay in t3 & t4.

you are right, they are surviving with the adaptives, but i don’t understand the damage part - usually a cruise ship cannot orbit you at adaptive speed, and it would make a flyby leaving a bit of damage behind. proportionally to normal ways of flying the same ships they actually damage a lot less.

 

Also, ECMs really, really suck at catching good cruise fits, especially cruise gunships, except with the energy siphon. I know rumors are, ECMs are played because they want to counter this and that, but the truth is, ECM is played because it’s friggin OP, not really to counter anything.

 

but atm. anyway, as i said, i think with all the cruise troll madness going on, i am not supporting my own idea right now. :smiley:

20

I’ve caught several cruise engine tacklers with my waki ae in sec con.  Its pretty easy.  Just wait for them to try and capture your beacon, sneak up on them without locking, and when in range, ion diffuse them, drain energy (can’t cloak), and use stasis if they are still alive by the time the energy drain wears off which is rare.  (ECM is OP if you don’t have proton walls :-), and to guards ). 

 

As far as the damage part goes, even before the cruise engines, with double adaptives boosting both shield and hull resists close and past 100 add the module and vernier and some of those fed ships would be pretty evil in a dogfight.  Not QUITE as tanky as one with regular armor, but lots more dps.  Idk, I still like the concept though!