Mixed tiers T3-T4

Game Discussion PvP
#1

A very simple question, when are you returning it to normal?

Optional questions; - Why are above average players punished and put into higher tiers? 

                               - How do you think those above average players will react?

                              

I play T3 because i like the ships, i like squadding, I dislike the long waiting times in higher tiers, because i dont have time to level everything to max to compete in T4-T5 ( the syn, loyalty and credits needed is just ridiculous). I just had to fight a Tier 5 4 man squad with all maxed out orange/ purple modules in my green T5 ship. How much fun do you think I had? Undo it… or you ll lose yet another player…

 

PS1: invest in new servers, the lag makes tournament unplayable.

 

ps2: Dont come telling me that a I just need to learn to fly better. The gap between white syn level 1 or even green syn max ships and purple max ships is just huge.

 

PS3: Might be another topic concerning this but your search function on the forum doest allow me to search; its flooded after every attempt,  I m not planning to wait 400 seconds to search a second time.

 

 

 

 

#2

+1

#3

That feeling is excatly how new players feel fighting U in T3 Erador

#4

+1

 

This is a serious issue that the devs really didn’t think about before they implemented it.

 

Mixing tiers is never a good idea, and every time it has been tried in the past, the overwhelming majority of players hated the change, and it was reverted. Why do you bother to try again when you can expect the same results? Like Albert Einstein said, “Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results.” Why can’t the devs accept that this literally is the definition of insanity and give up trying to mix tiers, it won’t work.

 

If the goal of mixing tiers was to decrease queue times and balance games, it has achieved quite the opposite effect really. Queue times are even longer now than they were before (I used to wait a max of 2-3 min in T3 queues, 4-5 max in T5). From what I’ve heard from the lower tiers, queue times have skyrocketed to well beyond 5-6 minutes. T4 and 5 seem to have faster queue times, but this is only because T3 players are now put into T4 games, so many of them decide to simply run T5’s to avoid being undermatched. Which brings me to balancing games. This update ruined game balance. Matches in T3 used to be a heck of a lot more fair then they are now. White/green T3 ships stood a lot better chance against purple T3’s than they do now against purple T4’s. Yes, very experienced and good pilots can do well against T4 ships in their T3 ships, but let’s have a look at why.

 

  1. Some of these players have over 2 years of experience under their belt. So naturally, they understand the game very well and know how to fly.

  2. These players are very skilled compared to your average pug. If you look at the players that do well in T4 with T3 ships, their stats will reflect that they are far above-average players.

  3. They are using all purple T3 ships to face against green/white T4s.

 

Reason 2 is one reason that I feel the devs implemented this change, but they completely overlooked the fact that these above average players are definitely in the minority in this game, and they also overlooked the fact that stats in this game are extremely easy to manipulate. A player can easily build up his stats in 2-3 games for matchmaker to view him on the same level as someone who actually has maintained good stats through his entire career. So because of this, players that shouldn’t be bumped up into higher tiers are getting bumped up.

 

Here’s another reason why mixed tiers doesn’t work. Some players don’t have ships from the next tier up, so why force them to move up when they don’t want to. Nothing says “we value our players” like forcing them to do things they don’t want to if they wish to continue playing.

 

Back to game balancing: Even vets who use all purple T3 ships in a T4 game, will stand no chance against vets who use all purple T4s. You can’t do mixed tiers, but still leave loopholes for vets to farm, which is currently what is happening in T4. Soooo many vets are squadding up in T4 with all purple premiums and R11’s so that they can farm the T3 players who have no idea what is going on. If you are going to implement a change with the intent of bumping high-skill vets into the next tier, you need to make sure it works without minimal flaws and loopholes before you actually implement it. Last time mixed tiers was applied, loopholes were left in it as well. These same farmers got in their squads with all premiums/R8s in T3 and farmed the T2s who had no idea what was going on. So please, for the sake of this game. Revert this change before it does more damage, damage that may become irreversible.

 

On the note of the OP’s PS’s.

 

  1. This really should happen, the current servers are cr@p as they can’t even support the normal amount of players logging in/playing.

 

  1. I partially addressed this in my above statements, but the gap between Mk1 gear and Mk4 gear is far too large.
#5

Git gud.

#6

They should just do profile stats per month… then use skill rating as a tool to push players up to T4… btw why do I only get RU servers in T4? WTF is that?

#7

+1

#8

They should just do profile stats per month… then use skill rating as a tool to push players up to T4…

so you are suggesting punishing good players? This sounds like a great idea! 

#9

+1 please solve this issue before it get worse

#10

+1

#11

Problem is low player base (everybody know that) … there are not enough players for 5 separate tiers. Solution is very simple. For example 3 tiers only.

 

  1. tier r1-5 (no veterans allowed)

  2. tier r6-10

3 tier r11-15

 

But … differences between ships ranks should be reduced, differences between levels of the same ship should be reduced (level bonuses should be distributed evenly on all levels - no 2,4,8 system)  and advantage between mk1 - mk4 modules and weapons drastically reduced. Somebody thought that huge differences between ship and module strength will force players to spend more but it backfired … 

 

Matchmaking … should be totally reworked. This one is disaster.

 

That is all and  this game could be Counter Strike of space genre … if there is a time left.

 

 

Servers and advertisement - and other financial stuff - i don’t have enough data  to write about that so I won’t.

#12

so you are suggesting punishing good players? This sounds like a great idea!

Why is it punishing. Erador is bitching how he gets farmed in T5 coz he has green kits, but when he farmes players like that in T3 it’s O.K. It’s not punishing anyone… I like this change coz before I had to play T4/5 in small teams, it pushed me back to T3 (large teams)…Now I can play T4/5 and have fun. This is a good way to get players to play T4/5… Devs just need to find a better way of calculating who has to move to T4 & who can stay in T3. And maybe put a a notice on players profile so they know there is no T3 for them.

I suggest next:

  1. Players profile needs to have monthly stats (ELO needs to be in there)

  2. Launch screen needs to have a notice (T3 not allowed)

  3. Having T3 ships that need synergy in your lineup keeps u in T3 (if u have one ship like this and it does not change in a month u move to T4 if your ELO is to high)

  4. And number of battles needs to be taken into account

#13

I don’t agree with the current mm changes, because this just unfair, and punish the good players based on a hidden and mythical ELO number. 

The game is very very grindy and don’t be surprised if the playes doesn’t like to give up their gear in T3 and start grind in T4.

 

If the devs want to create more linear system, I’m open for that, but that needs full rediesign of the rank and Tier system, reorder maybe some of the implants.

Fun fact we have playerbase problems, but when we get finally a decent amount, the servers starts dyeing, and doesn’t let them login, what will produce a playerbase drop.

 

Another option what I prefere is remove one Tier.

Seems the 5 Tier is too much for the game. I suggest to rollback the current changes and make a full redesign, split the ships into 4 Tiers.

T1 = R1 - R4 

T2 = R5 - R7

T3 = R8 - R10/11

T4 = R11/12 - R15

 

To make a redesign like this, the Implants needs to be changed, and the R11-R12 ships needs to be changed a bit.

 

As I see the T4 is the no mans land. There is a very strong line between the T3 and T4. Realistic battles, important implants, Orange weapons, more modules…

Force push players through that line is not a good idea, and not fair at all.

 

Currently NO reasonable exclusive content in T4. The only impact what most of us feels, our grind was fiddling. With the Tier reduce we could keep our gear, and our T3 ships doesn’t become useless.

I can’t support the current handycap system.

#14

So when you are the full purple guy in your 3-4 man squad farming green geared randoms it’s ok, but if you’re the green random facing purple 4 men squads in T5 it’s no fun, right?

#15

So when you are the full purple guy in your 3-4 man squad farming green geared randoms it’s ok, but if you’re the green random facing purple 4 men squads in T5 it’s no fun, right?

I suggest you to try it. Easy to talk if you do not play. (The patch was on 09.03)

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#16

I suggest you to try it. Easy to talk if you do not play. (The patch was on 09.03)

 

My argument would be the same, you like most of the veterans are mad because you can’t farm n00bs anymore in your mighty T3 squads. But after 6140 battles you should have more than enough resources to play T4 and T5 with full purple ships. I do with 2k less games played than you.

 

Instead of whining why don’t you consider leveling up and playing T5? If games are so small and queues so long it’s because of ppl sticking to T3 instead of going higher tiers, if you and anyone complaining started all playing up there, you would find each other, hopefully in big games, and would actually have to fight for the win and not just stomp the randoms.

 

 

The fact that I don’t play doesn’t mean I lost my common sense. 

#17

Since it looks like you have to be playing actively to give you opinion, I will support this.

 

So when you are the full purple guy in your 3-4 man squad farming green geared randoms it’s ok, but if you’re the green random facing purple 4 men squads in T5 it’s no fun, right?

 

You can post my game time if you want.

#18

My argument would be the same, you like most of the veterans are mad because you can’t farm n00bs anymore in your mighty T3 squads. But after 6140 battles you should have more than enough resources to play T4 and T5 with full purple ships. I do with 2k less games played than you.

 

Instead of whining why don’t you consider leveling up and playing T5? If games are so small and queues so long it’s because of ppl sticking to T3 instead of going higher tiers, if you and anyone complaining started all playing up there, you would find each other, hopefully in big games, and would actually have to fight for the win and not just stomp the randoms.

 

 

The fact that I don’t play doesn’t mean I lost my common sense. 

 

Sorry but the fact you don’t play makes your opinions irrelevant for me. Maybe I’ll also fight for some changes on one of my previously played game’s forum. Seems this is a nice hobby.

 

 

Since it looks like you have to be playing actively to give you opinion, I will support this.

 

So when you are the full purple guy in your 3-4 man squad farming green geared randoms it’s ok, but if you’re the green random facing purple 4 men squads in T5 it’s no fun, right?

 

You can post my game time if you want.

 

I like you grumpy Evi :slight_smile: I know you play and I take you seriously. And yes it would be fun because that would mean we can squad up in T5. Even if I don’t like the T5 meta. But I think the Tier reduce would be a better and much more fair solution.

#19

>mfw I’ve been playing T5 in my mostly green ships for the longest time and not bitching about my gear

>mfw I have no face

#20

Well if there is this ELO rating why can’t the vets just be matched to each other and the ‘newbies’ face each other without this silly uptiering?

 

The most annoying thing is the amount of money invested into T3 premium ships and now I get punished using them. Facing fully pimped T4 killsquads in T3 ships is no fun. Yet it seems ok that T4 ships can get a very easy time now. If you playing in big teams this can work but when it’s 4v4 or 5v5 which most matches seem, that it is not fun.

 

Also, what are we going to do when the below average players get to T4? Punish the above average T4 players? I dunno, too much carebearing going on here, players have to face the good players at some point. And T3 isn’t exactly farming ‘Aces’ there are/were a lot of skilled pilots there, so that is a bit of a silly thing to say. If anything there is probably an equal ratio of Aces in T4 and T5 thanks to all the tier rushers.

 

Why not have some sort of ‘exam’ before you can progress to the next tier? Make sure that players at least have an idea of what is going on and what to do before progressing to the next.

 

Why not have have an actual incentive to get the vets to play more T4 or T5, without punishing them for playing T3?