Long Range Frigate: Most useless class?

I used to love my Empire and Jericho frigates, but lately I feel like I’m more of a burden on my team than anything else.

The role of a Long Range frigate, one would think, would be as sort of a quasi-Guard; setting up an overwatch position and denying access, keeping the enemy bottled up hiding behind cover. Instead, Long Range frigates as they are presently implemented seem to almost force the player to camp in their own spawn rather than moving anywhere tactically advantageous.

LRFs are as slow as Guard frigates but without the shields, hull or close-defense modules to make them anything other than a suicidal sitting duck in close support, but they also lack the speed or utility modules (Warp Gate) of the Engineer allowing them to actually navigate the battlefield. Often, by the time you reach an advantageous position, the battlefield has changed and your position is no longer relevant.

Their module selection is nothing to write home about either. A 20% damage boost to sniper/torpedo damage that lasts for 20 seconds, which is long enough for just 5 sniper shots and barely long enough for 2 torpedos, and a module to make you untargetable for 20 seconds as long as you don’t move which I have yet to discern the use for as you’re still a giant stationary target and, at least with the Empire frigates, have a giant glowing red spotlight indicating exactly where you are to whomever you’re firing at.

But the final nail in the coffin of LRFs is that the one thing which their supposed to excel at - long-range damage - they aren’t even particularly helpful with. Yeah, the Disintegrator sniper can deal pretty good damage (almost 7500 with a Mk III weapon equipped) but it’s basically impossible to hit an Interceptor unless they’re standing still, and even a Fighter can easily dodge your shots at 75%+ of max range. The only thing you can hit reliably are other frigates, and they have enough HP that they can usually get behind an asteroid to heal unless you manage to catch them completely out in the open. Often I find myself thinking that I could be doing more damage reliably with my lasers at medium range save for the whole suicidal sitting duck thing. As for the Jericho torpedo, it can be completely neutralized by a single Guard frigate with a missile shield.

So am I alone in thinking that the Long Range frigate kind of sits in a No Man’s Land of uselessness? In my opinion, a speed buff bringing them in line with Engineers would go a long way towards correcting that. They don’t have the “tonnage” of the Guard frigates, after all, so why should they be as slow as them? It’s not as if a little extra speed would suddenly make them overpowered, and it would at least allow them to actually adapt to changing battlefield conditions. That and/or give them access to the Warp Gate module. I understand the rationale for giving it to Engineers, but their increased speed I feel allows them to keep up well enough with the front line as it is that they don’t need warp gates to traverse the battlefield nearly as much as LRFs.

For once, I have to agree. Sadly LRFs are dead. They are too weak and vulnerable alone. I used to love my disintegrator, now its absolutely useless. 

Even Guard Frigates got hurt, they can do even less in combat than Long Range Frigates. The best analogy is a giant shield with barely any offensive ability against the lightest armed fighter. I would say in comparison at least the Guided Torpedo and Disintegrator craft can harass and knock out low shield enemies, the Guard Frigate is just a damage sponge floating in space. In some cases, an absurdly durable hulk that has no real ability to coherently fight back.

Even Guard Frigates got hurt, they can do even less in combat than Long Range Frigates. The best analogy is a giant shield with barely any offensive ability against the lightest armed fighter. I would say in comparison at least the Guided Torpedo and Disintegrator craft can harass and knock out low shield enemies, the Guard Frigate is just a damage sponge floating in space.

 

Dude, Guard frigates are awesome at defending beacons and helping support the front line. Set up shop around a beacon with a Propulsion Inhibitor and you’ll ruin the day of any Interceptor or Fighter that gets too close, particularly if you’ve got friendlies nearby to mop them up while they flounder about. If things get too hairy, activate your Pulsar. Not to mention your complete invulnerability to and ability to block missiles with a Missile Shield active which, as I mentioned earlier, completely negates the entire class ability of a Jericho LRF.

I do agree though, the Long Range Frigates are not as good at their job as they should be, even if one decides to use abilities that effect their projectiles. I don’t see any Jericho Missile Frigates flying around much anymore. 

Jericho frigs’ guided missile is a complete joke compared to disintegrator frigates. The dps is significantly less not even counting missile travel time. Compare that to federation snipers and there isnt even a point to having any other frigate type.

 

Federation frigates get ~5000 damage every 3 seconds, with a flight time of a few seconds, while jericho gets ~8500 ever 16s + missile flight time which can easily be 10 seconds on its own.

 

What completely breaks Jericho frigs though, are the anti missile modules. a single anti missile mod can completely shut down a Jericho frig making it completely useless unless you move in, which is suicide thanks to how poor Jericho frigs are at damage control.

 

Finally, federation snipers completely outrange Jericho frigs, 12000m compared to 10000m.

 

Federation snipers have such a ridiculous damage level and ease of use, its completely unbalanced versus other frigate types.

 

I would like to see Jericho frigates damage increased significantly to compensate for being completely inferior in every area. If you want to leave the anti missile BS that completely cripples the Jericho frig, at least give us the ability to 1 shot interceptors and fighters with our missile.

I don’t see Jericho missile frigs anymore, that is saying something 

Ease of use? lol, have you tried sniping interceptors and fighters that move all over the place? The further away you are, even the slightest movement of the one your tracking will make you miss your shot. A jericho frigate torp will almost always hit unless ofc anti missile module, but if not having one of those against you, you will always hit.

Certainly not always hit, but it is a little easier than sniping with the disintegrators.

 

But abandonment of them (or just not seeing too many any more) is pretty simple as A: Eventually, any user realizes that unless you want to just annoy teammates by blowing them out of the sky at the same time, usage is limited, and B: With the ship Role Changes, plus massive blind spots the Jericho Frigs had anyway, They’re really kinda appalling on the field.

 

Ok, that’s just my personal opinion, but I had enough frustrations with using them that I did completely abandon them (both Guard and Long-Range Versions)

Jericho Frigates are mostly worthless in T3, specifically because of the anti-missile module, but also due to the weapons they get to use.

 

They were really fantastic in T2, that was where they would shine - A good balance of offensive and defensive power, and their primary ability wasn’t denied them. They could support from range or close in, and had good utility on the battlefield.

 

T3 brings stunlocks and anti-missile spam, which really kills Frigate use, but especially kills Jericho frigate use.

 

Nobody flies the missile frigates now because they pop instantly, have no weapon bonus, and do relatively minor burst damage - My Guard frigate can take 8+ guided missiles on its shields before they pop. That’s pretty pathetic.

Federation snipers? I’m sure you mean empire.

 

I personally think long range gunships should all have the guided torpedo module. That and granted active modules that alter the effect of the torpedo rather than the damage of it. Like making it leave an AoE field or make the torpedo immune towards missile countermeasures.

 

The disintegrator, though it is a powerful sniping ability, I really think it should just be set as a tool. An ability for support ships such as the engineer to keep enemies from cloaking, draining energy, or one of those long range poke tools…

 

Though long range gunships are not entirely useless though if you figure out a good build for them. Though really they should have made some kind of destroyer class rather than a ship that relies on its special module for damage…

The damage output should be increased in some way. Sniper and Torpedo modules should become a specialized tool (for example with more resistance penetration but lower overall damage then fully buffed regular weapons). That could make long range frigates into long range damage dealers who specialise in taking out those truly hard to kill tanky targets and give them an overall use with high regular weapon dps.

Okay, here’s an idea; what if the Disintegrator is changed to an “overcharge” style module that changes the damage type of your weapon to the optimal type for your target? it could even have a small aoe.

I made a suggestion thread with ways to improve and balance Long Range frigates: [http://forum.star-conflict.com/index.php?/topic/19501-suggestions-for-making-long-range-frigates-less-useless/](< base_url >/index.php?/topic/19501-suggestions-for-making-long-range-frigates-less-useless/)

For once, I have to agree. Sadly LRFs are dead. They are too weak and vulnerable alone. I used to love my disintegrator, now its absolutely useless. 

 

You said it… alone… a long range frigate is vulnerable, and likely so quickly an often dead as to be useless in higher tier matches. The really weird thing is that WITH A TEAM that divides roles, provides cover, an supports each other the very SAME LRF’s become rather hard hitting hammers of god. My T2 Templar punches for around 9k with a torp hit armed with mk3 hail plasma. I enjoy the safety provided by 2 fighters that perform interdiction, and in turn supported by engineer and guard frigates.

 

I’m not sure I agree with their role being dead… If by chance you mean that lone hero LRF’s sitting in random games after solo joining are dead… then yes, and I think that was exactly what the dev’s intended to do. Before the patch, every other comment in general and on the forums was bout “useless no0b” sniper frigates that sat there doing nothing for their team. Lots of things contributed to that issue. One of the easiest fixes was to take away their ability to be a swiss army frigate, one ship does it all. If you want to tank, you go guard, with support. You want to swarm the objective or dogfight you go inty or fighter, with hopefully support. You want to provide heals, you now have engy frigates. Some use, and can argue, that engy frigs can still do it all. It’s a valid take in some cases, but again with organized teams, a solo engy charging mid field can measure their life expectancy in seconds.

 

I think LRF’s work fine, it’s the player base that’s going to have to adjust. It’s odd to me that the idea of getting and giving support is such a difficult issue for those that play this game for longer then a week. At no time is there any sort of single player aspect. Every mode requires you team up. Aside from luck, every mode requires and excels from a group that coordinates roles an makes teamwork a priority.

 

Consider a team that has 3 torp frigs working on called, focused targets, that their fighters will clean up after ripping shields and doing damage. Beacon hunt fighter/inty swarm on objective…np 3 torps are suddenly not trivial anymore as half their fast movers are wonder what just hit them… engy support… the covert ops just took it out. Guards moved in to anti missile… they just got met with guards in turn and fighters to support after having 2 torps get through an drop shields…

 

It’s not foolproof an such a team makes mistakes an gets countered, but it’s not often. I’m not sure if it’s because others won’t organize, or ignore available tactics… The army doesn’t generally send one piece of arty to shell a target, neither should you expect a lone LRF to carry the day. Combine arms folks changes the issue a fair bit.

 

That said, I do not feel LRF’s are balanced… for that matter many ships of many tiers an classes have been left hanging since the radical balance patch. It’s gonna take time I think for those issues to be dealt with. It feels like right now the dev’s are focused on getting in the bigger framework mechanics an making general adjustments before settling down to the finer details.

I disagree, you’ve got half your ships sitting in one spot, perhaps not on the objective but still close by.  This will win in random PvP against an uncoordinated group, but by the same token two engineering frigates and two guard frigates can jump on an objective and hold it almost as well.  And in detonate or recon your group wouldn’t do much good at all.  

 

LRF frigates don’t have the resilience or defenses they used to, so any fighter or interceptor can destroy them easily enough, but at range they don’t do enough to shut down or hold an area.   A single LRF isn’t going to be able to burn an engineering frigate off an objective, nor prevent a fighter or interceptor from closing.  They really need a bonus to damage or projectile speed to assist with their function.  If a LRF is watching an area you should have to counter with a LRF of your own, flank with a smaller ship, or warp in a guard ship.  

 

Most games I just bum rush them with my fighter, and they get one or two shots before they are cut down.  I may take one or two shots on the way in, but that is what cloak or dispersion shield are for. They often are not supported because they need to be away from the action and are too slow to keep up.  Why have two other ships out of the fight, just so your LRF can keep firing?  

 

Perhaps it is different when you have clans fighting, and they can coordinate, but in the pugs it just seems to be very hard for LRFs to make an impact.

Perhaps it is different when you have clans fighting, and they can coordinate, but in the pugs it just seems to be very hard for LRFs to make an impact.

 

 

Now that is a true statement… question is, an it’s a tough one actually. How to balance a LRF so you can be something more then XP waiting to happen for the enemy, without giving a coordintated team something that when used in number and with purpose can shut down entire sections of a map at will. As they stand now you can deny something like a beacon, easily unless the enemy is equally coordinated and able to coordinate a multi prong full team assault to shut you down.

 

For lack of a better analogy… think of LRF like wizards… too much power and they run amok… not enough an they’re all glass no cannon.

for the tankiness they lack, they got quite a lot of dmg. just balances out.

 

Which fps game has snipers, that are as hard to kill as fully armored frontline tanks?

for the tankiness they lack, they got quite a lot of dmg. just balances out.

 

Which fps game has snipers, that are as hard to kill as fully armored frontline tanks?

 

except Jericho frigates are entirely worthless because the amount of missile defense even in PUG games means they have 0dps where it counts. The only frigates right now that have any sort of role are disintigrator frigs.

for the tankiness they lack, they got quite a lot of dmg. just balances out.

 

Which fps game has snipers, that are as hard to kill as fully armored frontline tanks?

 

Which FPS game has snipers that are 450 lbs lardasses which take 5 years to waddle their way to a sniper perch with no real way of camoflaging or hiding themselves, with a giant glowing beacon and laser beam for all to see announcing to the entire battlefield exactly where they are, and then barely deal more dps than your average frontline guy with an SMG? Which FPS game has a class with a passive low-level ability that completely blocks any sniper rounds in a 6800m sphere around the objective area?