How to fix the destroyers without fixing them

Game Discussion Balance
#1

everyone complaining about destroyers being overpowered just don’t get the point, they are meant to be overpowered.

 

Now before you run off and start crying about it i think we can all agree that they are being overused hell even frigates are too.

 

so lets get too it, as it is at the moment destroyers work well in all game modes except pvp and because of this we get whiny idiots screaming OP but if we stop and think about it.

 

what REALLY needs to happen is to limit the number of destroyers that can take part in a pvp match to 1 or 2 per team, and anyone else that wants to fly a destroyer in that match must enter a queue before they can use their destroyer, and when a player with a destroyer dies the next person in the queue gets a message saying they can use theirs now and they can choose to switch or pass to the next person in the queue, this will mean destroyers will stay and a powerful ship but will completely remove destroyoballs meaning the other players can easily swarm a solo destroyer and kill it without worrying about more of them.

 

as for this idea i would even go so far as to say there should be a frigate limit of 3 per team too, to get rid of the frigballs too, this would not only stop huge teams of destroyers and frigates but force the teams to stay close and work together more.

 

 

 

also maybe someone with better English can try to write this up better. no idea how well it did with it.

#2

I agree with this, limiting them is the perfect way to stop them from being spamming and people crying, they are balanced and blend into the fight if only there are a few on a team

+1 

#3

+1

#4

This was supposed to happen a while ago, but someone in MM management screwed up.

#5

IMO. The good thing Dessies seem to have bring more of lately is - believe it or not - focused fire. There is actually some teamwork happening from time to time!! I must say, some games have been really wonderful to play. 

The problem is, if course the “saturation” of Destroyers in PVP… 

#6

Or we could make destroyer respawn rate to be 2 mins and make it take up 2 ships slots… 

#7

I got 1 idea!We can stop this agony once and for ever!

NEW:

Avoidance/Evasion/Dodge

inerceptors base avoidance 150 %

fighters base avoidance 115 %

frigates base avoidance 75 %

suppresor class base avoidance 0 %

 

NEW:

Accuracy 

all ships have base accuracy 50%

 

example:

you miss 100% of time against interceptors (miss,miss,miss,miss,miss)

you miss 65%% of time against fighters ( miss,miss,hit,miss,miss,hit)

you miss 25% of time against frigates (miss,hit,hit,hit,miss,hit,hit,hit)

you always hit destroyer bcs 0 avoidance

 

so if you wanna hit something you have to buff your accuracy instead of dmg dmg dmg dmg DMG DMG DMG

 

NEW:

Accuracy amunition

buff your base accuracy for some % and that will make destroyers high depented to use accuracy buffs then dmg or resistance,so suppressor class will be send to pve and less to pvp!

 

NEW:

Pierce ammunition

reduce enemy resistance for some %

so as some1 calculated before if your resistance go negative,you dont resist incoming dmg and other way you take bonus damage equal to your -% ( for -50% resistance your enemy gain +50% dmg on his main weapon-you take +50% more dmg then normal)

so with this you can buff your dmg to bigger ships and that can make some balance in game between small and big ship!!!

 

this is just example,hope devs read this suggestion pls

-why is this fair-bcs 1 destroyer count as 1 small ships in kills so think what you made… tottaly unbalanced new class!!

 

ayax15back <<<

#8

I have better idea. Maybe people stop acting dumb, flying out into open and actually focus on roles instead of mindless pewpew? Only role that currently is too weak on the battlefield with  destroyers are guards - others are working just fine.

As I said earlier - people have to learn how to fly in teams and focus on objectives, focus on threats etc. 

#9

I have better idea. Maybe people stop acting dumb, flying out into open and actually focus on roles instead of mindless pewpew? Only role that currently is too weak on the battlefield with  destroyers are guards - others are working just fine.

As I said earlier - people have to learn how to fly in teams and focus on objectives, focus on threats etc. 

there are no teams dude if teams have 8/10 destroyers in both,so most ppls dont even fly they just sit and trade,and collateral dmg is those few small ships what suffer,also 1 destroyer count as 1 kill like small ship,and other way 1 small ship vs 1 destroyer(desi few shoot it and small ship takes 2 minutes to take it down),if there are 5 ppls vs 1 desi they also take some time to take it down and that 1 destroyer can kill 1 or few…many ppls ragequit game,and that is biggest problem now,have to be fixed asap!

#10

 

 

#11

Crit chance is as much randomnes as we need.

#12

 Dessies and frigs should be unable to cap bacons and 2 mins respawn for dessies.

 Side note: This looks so much like when styx had 6 turrets, history repeating itself.

#13

Accuracy aint a bad idea if aiming is easy. “Ace Online” works that way, but theres no spread, crit chance, crit dmg, proj speed, explotion radious (for most weapons)…and aiming is really easy. SC is a complete diferent world where that factor would really xxxx up anything…without reason. Why would you aim correctly and then expect your shots to hit?

#14

Accuracy aint a bad idea if aiming is easy. “Ace Online” works that way, but theres no spread, crit chance, crit dmg, proj speed, explotion radious (for most weapons)…and aiming is really easy. SC is a complete diferent world where that factor would really xxxx up anything…without reason. Why would you aim correctly and then expect your shots to hit?

I played AirRivals(ace online) for 4-5 years and i know what you are talking about,but it should be not that strong as there,in season 3 evasion/defense wasn’t that hard and you needed so much skill to do some dmg and survive,after season 4 they made permanent eva/def what destroyed game so ppls always “miss,miss,miss,miss” and always “1,1,1,1,1,1” dmg,but thing what i said is just to prevent destroyers to deal big amount of damage,maybe other ships should stay where they are but destroyer need big rework,bcs its unbalanced ship.Some ppls told me “so what,it is suppressor class,its made to dominate!” lolol 

And by the way items in airrivals has some modifications and it is explosion radius,missile speed,missile angle/rotate,accuracy,pierce accuracy-penetration,max/min dmg,rate of fire,distance etc but there most damage go direct to locked target like all kind of guided missiles as secondary weapon,and primary weapon is some guns and you shoot in free aim like in SC. So its similar to SC…

And its not just in Airrivals,check many other games.

#15

+1 to the idea of limiting destroyers. 

 

Maybe people stop acting dumb, flying out into open…

 

Not my fault I spawned in an open area in a frigate and got locked onto by two destroyers. Some maps are also too open for slow ships to move safely. 

#16

If you disagree about evasion,so increase base movement speed to all ships.

Destroyer can fly 200-300 m/s at the moment=frigate/fighter base speed?

Increased base movement speed for:

inters+50-100 m/s base speed

fighters 50-75 m/s

frigates 25-50 m/s 

So modules will give more %:

before:

inters base movement speed ~500 + 10%=500+50=550 m/s

reworked:

inters base movement speed ~550-600 +10%=605-660 m/s 

This way all ships in t3 can run away and t5 ships can easily reach max speed cap (700 m/s - enough to dodge projectile speed)

Keep destroyer overpowered in small area,reduce wormhole projector range to 2 000 m range so that module will be used for fast escape not engage into enemy spawn spot.

A lot ppls love destroyers,but also a lot ragequit game bcs of them,so if you know some better plan,show it,lets push pressure on devs to balance them.

#17

Wormhole is fine. Any destroyer that dares venture close to the enemy spawnpoint is an idiot and soon to be demolished, and if he isn’t, then that counts as purposeful spawncamping and is bannable.

#18

I played AirRivals(ace online) for 4-5 years and i know what you are talking about,but it should be not that strong as there,in season 3 evasion/defense wasn’t that hard and you needed so much skill to do some dmg and survive,after season 4 they made permanent eva/def what destroyed game so ppls always “miss,miss,miss,miss” and always “1,1,1,1,1,1” dmg,but thing what i said is just to prevent destroyers to deal big amount of damage,maybe other ships should stay where they are but destroyer need big rework,bcs its unbalanced ship.Some ppls told me “so what,it is suppressor class,its made to dominate!” lolol 

And by the way items in airrivals has some modifications and it is explosion radius,missile speed,missile angle/rotate,accuracy,pierce accuracy-penetration,max/min dmg,rate of fire,distance etc but there most damage go direct to locked target like all kind of guided missiles as secondary weapon,and primary weapon is some guns and you shoot in free aim like in SC. So its similar to SC…

And its not just in Airrivals,check many other games.

You may aim perfectly well with std weapon and missiles, but without a lock those shots will go through the target not hitting it. Only BGs can hit without locking and even that they have quite a big explotion radious, each missile can only hit 1 target. Destroyers are not effective at long distances: meson has a lot of spread, coilgun has slow projectiles, halo launcher has much slower projectiles. In Ace Online std weapons are hit-track, and missiles have a big lock on angle…planes are far easier to hit there than in SC; skill comes in other aspects for most of the cases.

#19

there are no teams dude if teams have 8/10 destroyers in both,so most ppls dont even fly they just sit and trade,and collateral dmg is those few small ships what suffer,also 1 destroyer count as 1 kill like small ship,and other way 1 small ship vs 1 destroyer(desi few shoot it and small ship takes 2 minutes to take it down),if there are 5 ppls vs 1 desi they also take some time to take it down and that 1 destroyer can kill 1 or few

That’s what I am talking about. I’m playing in more and more games,where actually people choose not to play destroyers when they are not needed. I know, you have to think how to do this and that’s what people don’t like. This morning 1 side - 1 engie, 1 command, 1 gunship 2 covops, 2 destroyers; other side 5 destroyers, LRF and guard. Domination mode. Enemy destroyers went to 2 beacons (2 and 3 of them) we went to capture the first while our destroyers started to shoot the middle one to prevent from capping. Command dropped shield havoc, covops went in with plasma arcs gunship just finished the job with destroyers. Capped the beacon, one of three enemy destroyers tried to scout, blinded, dead. That left two destroyers on the beacon, we repeated what have happened before. In the meantime first two enemy destroyers respawned, one warped to a beacon, where he was met with gravity well and I think blinded, cause he didn’t deploy his gravity lens, died quickly. It left another destroyer in the open so repeated sequence - white noise, plasma arc, focused fire, destro is going down. With three beacons under our control we won soon after that. Enemy lrf was shooting torpedoes and getting occasional torp from our destroyers, guard hmm I don’t remember what the guard was doing, but nothing of significance.

 

Yes, those games are rare as for now, but I just hope that soon enough people will start to think again, after novelty of destroyers will go away. If they don’t want to think and ragequit? Ok with me. I have enough of stupid people. This game is a little more than stay still, point, shoot. I wouldn’t bother about destroyers right now. I would rather started to think “why the heck are people with single ship in slot in T4 (Sorry - R10-12) capture the beacons battle?” Lack of manual? Training videos? Or is he just plainly farming synergy (which is one of the moronic reasons to “I’ll take jeri lrf for detonation and I will torp the hell out of that rock”). 

#20

I have better idea. Maybe people stop acting dumb, flying out into open and actually focus on roles instead of mindless pewpew? Only role that currently is too weak on the battlefield with  destroyers are guards - others are working just fine.

As I said earlier - people have to learn how to fly in teams and focus on objectives, focus on threats etc. 

I both agree and do not.

Flying out into the open in an unfocused pewpew mob is the hallmark of random pvp, everyone doing their own thing. Always has been in a way. Ppl are leveling, gaining x2 on specific ships, trying out a build, hungry for the win, being an idiot in spawn.

Problem is that before u could carry a game or have great impact on the outcome even if there where some halfwits on your team. Now players are forced into a situation where they have to work with said halfwits in order to get a win. It could/should work, but fact is it does not for the majority of games.

Its difficult enough to get a decent spec ops team to focus the defiler in a proper weapon range and some of those players have been hand picked. But now in pvp its no squads greater than two, now try and convince ur dumb ‘team’ to work toward something.

The spawn sitting lrf guys have never dreamed of going near a beacon, i dont see them getting those main weapons firing at a destroyer anytime soon. I also had a guy who reported me for cloaking in a destroyer, i asked if there was any guards around. He replied that there are no cloaking for guards in T3… we were both flying R11 destros at the time, also had a Tor S nearby.

How is anyone supposed to climb that mountain of idiocy, if anything u need a team to help u with your team some matches. Putting a big fat target in from of them should work but it doesnt, i dont believe anything will get randoms to work together anymore. The removal of proper squadding is another problem in relation to this.

There is definatly room for people to adapt their strategies the question is have they ever?

The other side of it is the destroyers themselves. R8 i dont have too much of a problem with however their barrier is stupid. R15 Mk5 Rails on a gunship with all mk4 passive support only knocks the barrier out in time for the next to go up. That needs addressing asap. It makes for very little variation in R8 destroyers, as they just shoot each other throwing up barriers in a mindless pewpew, doing very little or no damage yet still dominating the game with their other abilities.

R11 on the other hand has modules that are used in the same manner as things that were fixed in the past. The guards destructor beam that used to do aoe damage was everywhere for a time denying beacon captures and buying teams a ton of time. The gravy hole is the same thing only now u can deny the cap as well as fire off main weapons and other heavily destructive modules at the same time.

People are dumb or at least unconcerned with what they believe is not the proper objective. Luckily morons come destroyer sized too, but i think that is the problem that many have with it now. That some unskilled n00by dumb dumb can now have such a massive influence on the outcome of a battle. Even if it is just the time that it takes to remove them as a obstacle.