Exodus of Veterans from Star Conflict

Hello all,

 

I’ve been noticing over the past few months that the people I play with are becoming more and more absent; there are new people entering the game, but a lot of veterans are either leaving, or spending a fraction of the amount of time on that they once did. Of course people getting bored of a game happens, but this seems to have sped up a lot of late, which suggests to me that something has changed either in the game or in the community.

 

I have seen plenty of posts talking about very specific issues they have, but I’d like to see a bit of a discussion go on trying to work out if there really is something new that has changed and if so, what is it? If there is something, is there something that can be done about it that won’t just make some other aspect of the game worse? It’s very easy to call for change but not always so easy to see if that change is really, honestly possible, or if people would even be satisfied if that change occurred.

 

I’m going to drop a few things for starters down here that I have heard along with some thoughts (from myself and from some other friends I have spoken with) about whether these really are big enough problems to account for it.

 

  1. The main thing I’ve noticed is that people are saying the game is getting stagnant/isn’t getting enough decent new content. There are differing views within this and it’s hard to pin down the core of the issue. There have been new content releases, such as open space, dreadnoughts and craftable ships. So the problem clearly isn’t that there has been no movement at all, but that people aren’t happy with either the scale, the superficiality, or the quality. That or people think it’s a content issue or there’s actually something else that they can’t quite put their finger on, so they think it’s lack of new content that’s the problem.
     
  2. The grind is an issue that ties in with the point above. A lot of people think that open space is lacking that certain something that makes it a place people want to be, and therefore aspects of the game have been shoehorned in to force people there on a daily basis if they want PvP to be better for them (finding blueprints and the Dreaded Dailies). Again, there are questions within questions here. Is open space really that bad? Is the idea of dailies good but the execution bad? The thing is, the grind is a very core aspect of the game: people are avid ship collectors and the 'gotta catch ‘em all’ aspect of the game is something that drives a lot of people. Does this mean people will leave the game if there aren’t just more and more ships together? Is ship collection and synergising distracting people from a lack of other reasons to be in Star Conflict? A lot of people want new ships, but where do you stop? Wouldn’t that just be covering over the problem rather than fixing it? (Please bear in mind that this is all hypothesizing and brainstorming as opposed to a set opinion).
     
  3. Average skill level is decreasing or match-making has got less balanced - most people will say the latter. There has been a suggestion that people are so focused on synergising that they don’t focus on honing skill. Yes, it is known that the better you get the more likely it is that you will gain synergy quickly, but this isn’t necessarily in the forefront of people’s minds. This can mean that people who have worked on their skill will get lumped in with those that haven’t: this is linked with point 2 as the idea is that the grind in itself is what is distracting. A counter to this would be that it’s always been so, so it can’t really be that which has suddenly dropped numbers of veterans. Also, general player base reducing meaning less matches and less balanced matches can be an issue: how to counter this is difficult. What comes first, the chicken or the egg? Better player numbers to make the game better or a better game to make the player numbers better? Of course this subject is tied in with the perennial question of ‘do you want more matches, or more balanced matches?’ You can’t (necessarily) have it both ways and someone will always be unhappy.
     
  4. There is less skill needed these days. This covers the ECM/drones/frigball/aim-module angle. If people feel that you have to get to a stupendous skill level before that skill overrides other people’s module usage, the game can become very frustrating for people who appreciate skill-based playing (I’m talking quick reflexes, aiming and spacial awareness) as it feels like winning becomes a case of just picking the right ship, having teammates that don’t feed the enemy/sit on spawn and pressing the right buttons. Drones do not involve aim, they just involve placing a drone. I have yet to come across someone that doesn’t think guard frigates aren’t over-powered at the moment, even if they do think frigballs can be beaten with the right tactics. The problem becomes that games start to all look the same: it’s either the format where people use either ECM, frigball or recon-spam and the other team is forced to play a very rigid style to counter it (unless they’re in that very top percentile of players) or the team loses. This makes for a formulaic experience of the game that people really don’t seem to be enjoying.

There is more that I could write, both in support and counter to the things I have posted above, alongside the idea that there has just become a self-perpetuating negativity in the community itself as opposed to there being a problem in the game. Or even the idea that it really doesn’t matter if the veterans leave and that numbers will just pick up eventually in any case. However, I think it’s worth having a bit of a discussion to see if any interesting or helpful points come out.

 

So go ahead. Good luck. Have fun. :wink:

+1

 

I agree with your assessment.

It is correct and true.

We need advertisement and lighter economic model.

something happen…

  1. removal of SecCon

  2. implementation of unfinished seccon which is limited(T3 only and iridium prices) > 10k to enter dread fight is just ret@rded

something happen…

  1. removal of SecCon

  2. implementation of unfinished seccon which is limited(T3 only and iridium prices) > 10k to enter dread fight is just ret@rded

 

It’s what Skiffle said: good idea, bad execution.

I agree with points 3 + 4. Believe it or not but the grind was way higher when I started playing this game (in the days where t5 didn’t exist and you could put mines on every bloomin ship)

I agree with points 3 + 4. Believe it or not but the grind was way higher when I started playing this game (in the days where t5 didn’t exist and you could put mines on every bloomin ship)

it was higher, yes but mainly because back then it was more about luck to get purples, still you could skip ships entirely (I was R12 pretty quick in the old, while i needed a lot longer to reach r12 with other factions in the new system; after all you could just fly the same ship nonstop and do contracts). it is still too high, since it only retained a certain type of player from those times.

 

it is often noted in negative reviews, that without dlcs and stuff, you basicly do not advance at all. which of course imho is not completely true; but on the other hand, if i restart today, i am much faster and have no progression issues, but i also care less, since i have my main account with all shipsies, so probably this is something, we as veterans, cannot really see clearly.

lets say it otherwise: making progression slow as incentive to buy stuff is a bad model. we have to live with it. it is manageable, but definitely not on the plus side.

 

so just because it was grindier once, it doesn’t mean, it’s not now. however, the problem is not grind in terms of “bringing up some effort to play”, the problem is rather in the rewards, for both new and old players.

the goal of the game should not be to finish all ships and be done with it.

 

so basicly, i think point 2 is still important.

i’m not saying the game is without grind :-p, its just not as high as it used to be in the past

After 2000+ hours in any game, you will start to feel it getting repetitve. Even real life gets boring if you spend too much time doing the same thing! That is why holidays were invented. Now imagine if when you went on holiday (resp. took a break from a game), you would jump into a completely new life (resp. try a different game), wouldn’t you possibly want to stay there?

Now I’m getting a bit philosophic here, but put simply, I’m trying to say is that people come and people go. Veterans will be replaced by new veterans. The old ones are in a way going into retirement. And there’s nothing wrong with that.

After 2000+ hours in any game, you will start to feel it getting repetitve. Even real life gets boring if you spend too much time doing the same thing! That is why holidays were invented. Now imagine if when you went on holiday (resp. took a break from a game), you would jump into a completely new life (resp. try a different game), wouldn’t you possibly want to stay there?

Now I’m getting a bit philosophic here, but put simply, I’m trying to say is that people come and people go. Veterans will be replaced by new veterans. The old ones are in a way going into retirement.

It is time for me to retire!

Wall o’text

 

My opinions on your thoughts:

 

1- Hardly, we have open space, we have an evolving history (which is not big surprise, and cliché, but it is good enough), we have just introduced SQ and now it is way better than it was before, more akin to world of tanks clan wars. People are still adjusting to the new SQ, and dreads are still being built and balanced. Give it some time.

 

2- The grind is not that bad. You will never find the exact point for grind. There will be people who will think it is too easy, and people who still think that it is too hard. I played 3 months without license and I made more advances than I thought it was possible. Premium ships (because of free synergy) are good for farming but still, what do you really want? I wanted to have all ships but there are people who are content with just one branch of the tree and that is quite easy to get. Maybe it is because I’m used to the Warframe / World of tanks / Warthunder grind, which is way worse. But still are enjoyable games, as this one is.

 

3- This is mainly to the new influx of new players. One year ago we were such a small community that everyone was decent because only hardcores knew and played this game. Now we are having a lot of new players, which are still trying to get the ropes of the game. And because of that a good veteran, or a team of such, can easily carry the game alone. MM cannot counter that if there isn’t enough veterans or good players available.

 

4.- ECM spam has always been that way. Concerning tackler drones, finally they are useful, and what they are meant to be, a counter to interceptors. I’m against the use of crystal drones and DD missiles in tier 2, but aside from that, if you are afraid of the ECM spam, you can fly as takamina, with double proton wall and J2 implant. And lead by example, because you owls are not precisely without sin, using spirits with DD in tier 3 most of the time.

 

All in all, it is normal that some people goes and some other come. As long as you enjoy the game, who cares?

 

All in all, it is normal that some people goes and some other come. As long as you enjoy the game, who cares?

because you owls are not precisely without sin, using spirits with DD in tier 3 most of the time.

I will not say anything against your opinion, but generalising like that will get you knowhere and also won’t provide an accurate acessment. In fact there is 2 players from OWL using this. Just because 2 of them use it doesn’t mean that the DD ecm is our standard repartoir.

So don’t dip one individuum into the DD sauce just because you met OTHER owls doing it.

On the subject of Double Drones   (DD)

 

Well the argument on the use of “skill” versus “non skilled” weaponry has been going on since the beginning of time.    For whatever reason there seems to be a this elitist attitude among a certain few that if their demise was NOT “honorable” by what is perceived to be an “skill” method there is a uproar.    The individuals that caused their demise are called a low life, unskilled… N00BISH etc etc…       

 

  While there are quite a few upper echelon “skilled” players but for a large majority to reach that level may be unrealistic.   For players to go on lambasting onto individuals negatively in public or private chat for whatever reason they felt ''slighted" or did not fall into a their certain category does not go well.

 

  I remember when use homing missiles fell was considered “unskilled” and if certain level of individuals demise was due to walking into a series of missiles vice getting “Shot” … all heck broke out.

 

Yes I am one of those that use DD in just about every ship in the lineup but get the most “hate” for the use with ECMs.  

 

While there may be many tiers I find it less stressful in T3 and occasionally down in T2.   You have less modules… implants to worry about and your build doesn’t take a rocket scientist to implement.    So again this thing about playing only in a certain tier is ludicrous to me.     

 

 

As my opinion this is a pew-pew shoot them up up game with objectives.  The understanding of how to achieve these objectives takes time\experience.  Coupled into this mix there is no way to force everyone of your team to fight for those objectives as there always other motives that come into play.

 

This is just a game… some people may be real good while others may not be at that level and objectively know it.   That is why the game has ‘Options’.

What I realized is that before the release of Season 2 players were happily pirating and destroying each other in open space. Now, it might take a week to come across a vet or a team doing stuff. There is no interest in the open anymore, except for the mono missions or for lower rank players. For the latter, however, it is a major hardship.

Everything Skiffle said is sadly true.

 

Too many vets are leaving this game, which is a huge shame for the vets that do stay.

 

I know I personally enjoy games that are challenging, and with less vets sticking around, the games become easier and more boring…

Everrdylost, DD means Doomsday I think. Several people use doomsdays on ECM (using the stun almost guarantees that the missile hits)

A guy killed me like this in t3 once. I was so enraged that I brought out my tackler and focussed just him for the rest of the game and the one after. He had a very hard time. I hope he learned his lesson that that tactic only works on Aces or while you have the element of surprise on vets.

CovOps with DD are THE Best!

 

:013j: *I still don’t get all that DD hate* :013j:

CovOps with DD are THE Best!

:013j: *I still don’t get all that DD hate* :013j:

Because they allow an interceptor to do 10k damage…

Because they allow an interceptor to do 10k damage…

but they so easy to avoid… and that 10k dmg is like one orion

CovOps with DD are THE Best!

 

:013j: *I still don’t get all that DD hate* :013j:

 

You spend too much time with Entersprite…

OT : yes, vets leave and come back. That pretty usual for a f2p game, I guess.
The grind is huge, but it became somewhat easier the more ship you max (fleet strenght mechanic). And premium. It’s laughable to being able to get more free synergy by flying a t5 premium than pexing a normal ship ni t3.

On DD topic : equivalent in damage is the EM torpedo. It’s not homing, and you get shitton of damage if you fire it at point blank.

It seems that the ecm hate train is a lot due to stasis > DD combo. Anyway, doomsday missile is re_tarded. Other homing missiles are balanced coz they do less damage. Removing doomsday could be a good point. It only bring frustration to pilot that get hit by it.

Tackler drones might be the counter for interceptor… Then, why is there an heavy drone? And I don’t call being 2-shot a counter. It’s an other re_tarded mechanic. Even when I destroy the tackler drones when I find it, it’s just no skill. Tackler leave drones, go on chameleon module mode, GG. Tackler is already a counter for inty with its other tools.

 

Tackler drones and doomsday missiles make me think that EM torpedo wasn’t too bad. And I freaking HATED EM torp back in the day where D doesn’t exist.

 

but they so easy to avoid… and that 10k dmg is like one orion

 

Not when you are in stasis, not when you are at point blank, not when your ship’s speed is less than the missile one.

Orion is an active module, not a secondary weapon (and it’s something around 10k total weapon damage for the full duration, not a 10k free instant damage).

It’s not even in the same league, as you can add the two of them. And orion is not the issue here.