Destroyers in Beacon Matches

Destroyers in matches with beacons (Domination and Bacon Hunt) present a unique problem to the game.

 

When the enemy team has a destroyer (or multiple destroyers) on the field, your team is faced with some choices:

  1. Focus the enemy destroyer and try to kill it

  2. Ignore the destroyer and capture beacons / plant bomb

  3. Respawn in destroyers to counter the enemy’s destroyers

 

 

The problem with option 1 is that killing a destroyer takes a long time, no matter how poorly it is built, and it usually requires several teammates working together to be successful. This takes players away from the objective (the beacons) and allows the enemy to cap. Plus if you are unsuccessful, then you are dead, your team is down however many players and the destroyer gets to continue making trouble for you, as stated below.

 

The problem with option 2 is that you now have a (many) destroyer(s) running around unchecked. Any even semi-competent destroyer can rack up a large number of points by spawn- or beacon-camping if left unchecked. Plus they can come after your team while they are capping beacons. This includes spawning black holes on beacons to prevent their capture by your team, and allowing their team to cap unaffected.  

 

The problem with option 3 is that now you have pilots who are not focused on the objective, but rather with killing each other. That is all well and good, if the game is only about killing other pilots, why have beacons in the first place? Plus, I don’t know of any pilot in the game who actually enjoys playing as a destroyer or against one. Especially so for pilots who want to help their team out by capturing beacons and dogfighting. They don’t want to be stuck in a slow-moving clunky ships simply so that their team has a chance of winning.

 

With the introduction of R11 destroyers that are capable of being faster and more maneuverable than most frigates and some fighters, these problems have been exacerbated. Black Holes on beacons are seriously broken and need to be removed.

 

To that end, I propose two solutions:

 

 

Solution 1: Remove Destroyers from Beacon Matches

Any player with a destroyer in their lineup will be unable to choose that ship for the battle.

Affects Beacon Hunt, Domination, Detonation, and Capture the Beacons (if reimplemented)

 

Q: But what about about players with only destroyer(s) in their lineup?

A: They will not be able to enter a match with beacons in it. This will result in longer queue times for those players who choose to play only destroyers. By the time a player builds a destroyer, they should be able to play with other ships, and there is no reason to queue with only a single destroyer, or multiple destroyers in their lineup to begin with.

 

 

Solution 2: Create  “Destroyer-Free Zones” around Beacons

In a certain radius around a beacon (say 3000m) the effects of destroyer modules would be nullified (except for turrets)

Affects Beacon Hunt, Domination, Detonation, and Capture the Beacons (if reimplemented)

Destroyers cannot activate their modules while they are inside of this area (again except for turrets)

The effects of destroyer modules cannot exist inside of the area

This means that Black Holes could not exist inside of this area, and that the effects of Black Holes outside of this area would not exist inside

Pyro-Emitters that are fired into this area would stop on the border and not continue inside

Tempest Launcher missiles and Photon Launcher projectiles would explode on the border of the area

Wormhole Generator projectiles would be absorbed by the border like if they hit a rock or object and would not result in teleport

Destroyers could still fire into and enter the area, but would be unable to use their modules

This way, a destroyer could no longer deny the capture of a beacon or the planting of a bomb, simply by using their modules

Also because of this, Destroyers would be unable to carry bombs in detonation

 

Thoughts?

2nd solution seems to work best as otherwise team battles/combat recon would be filled with destroballs.

 

Tbh a treatment of the symptom rather than the disease.

I find it really weird that people (devs included) come up with all these quirky glued on patches in order to fit the destroyers into the game as they currently are, rather than just nerfing the destroyers into line with other ships.

 

Just reduce their shield and hull volume by 40% and put self and team damage to the blackhole.

I’m against this as it’s just another non-skilled resolution to a non-existing problem.

I would say, just wait!

 

I have a gut-feeling (nothing less and nothing more) that the time until autumn the SC developers and designers introduce a major new version with lots of new content will be worth spend.

 

Supposedly, there will be new destroyer (hunters?) and even more new ships and new scenarios and new game mechanics, etc.pp. !

 

The [destroyers](< base_url >/index.php?showtopic=29008) were the birth-pangs, the Ultimate Destroyers contest a hint, and the remastered ships (Reaper & Phoenix) are just the [beginning …](< base_url >/index.php?/topic/30494-developer-blog-from-may-17-phoenix-and-reaper/)

Option 5: remove destroyers from PVP and restrict them to PVE/open space.

As someone said, you are treating the symptom here, and not the disease.

 remove destroyers from PVP and restrict them to PVE/open space.

That will not going to happen. Destroyer is a challenge only if it has skilled pilot. And this challange is still possible task.

That will not going to happen. Destroyer is a challenge only if it has skilled pilot. And this challange is still possible task.

 

Not without teamplay (not talking about squads-gameplay here, just the old good focus fire and modules use) like it happen 90% of the time in random pvp. 

Since now people, after months of mental regressions, don’t know anymore what supports role and teaming means (even vets plays like that now).

Not without teamplay (not talking about squads-gameplay here, just the old good focus fire and modules use) like it happen 90% of the time in random pvp.

Since now people, after months of mental regressions, don’t know anymore what supports role and teaming means (even vets plays like that now).

So instead of fighting the symptome of the problem(destroyer Q.Q), how about removing those skill-less person from PvP that can’t handle teamplay?

This thread is again filled with breed of Q.Q with just ‘Pro can’t easy solo a destroyer’ and skill-less people ‘Q.Q Don’t know how to engage a destroyer’.

So instead of fighting the symptome of the problem(destroyer Q.Q), how about removing those skill-less person from PvP that can’t handle teamplay?

This thread is again filled with breed of Q.Q with just ‘Pro can’t easy solo a destroyer’ and skill-less people ‘Q.Q Don’t know how to engage a destroyer’.

 

I don’t get it.

You want to stop playing?

I don’t get it.

You want to stop playing?

Stop either Q.Qing or playing. I’m next to fine with destroyer’s beings.

Stop either Q.Qing or playing. I’m next to fine with destroyer’s beings.

 

I don’t think you are entitled at any level to say to anyone in this thread to “stop whining”.

Someone that are [unable to aim with an hitscan weapon](< base_url >/index.php?/topic/30361-laseraiming/) and ignore 99% of the game mechanics should just not write a single arrogant word about anything.

I don’t think you are entitled at any level to say to anyone in this thread to “stop whining”.

Someone that are [unable to aim with an hitscan weapon](< base_url >/index.php?/topic/30361-laseraiming/) and ignore 99% of the game mechanics should just not write a single arrogant word about anything.

What is your contribution to this topic out of whine? Because arguments are lacking in all your posts.

If they are so ‘unbalanced’ you can easily give 5 arguments WITHOUT ANY COUNTER/BALANCE.

What is your contribution to this topic out of whine? Because arguments are lacking in all your posts.

If they are so ‘unbalanced’ you can easily give 5 arguments WITHOUT ANY COUNTER/BALANCE.

 

What is your level of knowledge of the game?

It is next to zero. You proved that multiple time.

 

That’s why you just don’t understand why people that know more than you: know that destroyers are unbalanced and don’t fit into star conflict gameplay when there is no teamplay anymore.

 

the fact that you think you are able to perform good in one of those is just the consequence to the fact they have tons of hp AND damage. A perfect choice for someone that have zero knowledge/skill.

If they are so ‘unbalanced’ you can easily give 5 arguments WITHOUT ANY COUNTER/BALANCE.

Balancing means that every ships class has its role and doesn’t completely get replaced/owned by another.

E.g. take a look at T4/5 Empire long range ATM, they have less DPS, less tank, less speed then an destroyer and they can even get killed by am destroyer that is 10km away. When there is one Destroyer who isn’t completely bad you can forget playing elrf.

I could give you more examples why destroyers are op but it looks like you don’t care about facts.

Balancing means that every ships class has its role and doesn’t completely get replaced/owned by another.

E.g. take a look at T4/5 Empire long range ATM, they have less DPS, less tank, less speed then an destroyer and they can even get killed by am destroyer that is 10km away. When there is one Destroyer who isn’t completely bad you can forget playing elrf.

I could give you more examples why destroyers are op but it looks like you don’t care about facts.

So a destroyer can easy snipe over 10km in every direction(without obstacles of course) in an easy fashion?

Tank is no option for LRF, so no argument. Speed is NO option for empire. DPS is hardly an argument with 6 vs. 8 turrets. Funny they seem to buffed the dps part of integrator(more damage vs. frigates and even more vs. destroyers)?

‘I could’ THEN DO IT. ENLIGHT ME. As I seem to be Ace without any knowledge.

So a destroyer can easy snipe over 10km in every direction(without obstacles of course) in an easy fashion?

Tank is no option for LRF, so no argument. Speed is NO option for empire. DPS is hardly an argument with 6 vs. 8 turrets. Funny they seem to buffed the dps part of integrator(more damage vs. frigates and even more vs. destroyers)?

‘I could’ THEN DO IT. ENLIGHT ME. As I seem to be Ace without any knowledge.

lel, so the Photon emitter doesn’t have 10km range and 2.Smth km/s projectile speed? Yes they buffed the disintegrator but this doesn’t change the fact that a destroyer can still stand somewhere and ‘snipe’ back and the more DPS I have is useless when he has an shield barrier where he can shout through and I have to destroy first and the 13k bonus DMG vs destroyer doesn’t apply to their static barrier

lel, so the Photon emitter doesn’t have 10km range and 2.Smth km/s projectile speed? Yes they buffed the disintegrator but this doesn’t change the fact that a destroyer can still stand somewhere and ‘snipe’ back and the more DPS I have is useless when he has an shield barrier where he can shout through and I have to destroy first and the 13k bonus DMG vs destroyer doesn’t apply to their static barrier

Okay… what things can be ‘sniped’ with 5s(!) incoming? You have no lead indicator and mostly only the visual silhoutte. Even strafing should be enough to avoid such hits. Except destroyer maybe, but they are balanced as big targets.

Shield barrier mean, he have no hull regen. Mean every hull damage is his final nail. Second barrier have no resistance, which mean DPS is real DPS. Third he NEED to deploy it at the direction the shot come from. Mean at broadside multiple of them are needed. That at least an argument, but hardly unbalanced a) he need to even have this b) he have no hull regen then c) Your team will have it easier as he need at least 1 of his shields for you. This game isn’t solely balanced about 1 vs. 1.

Okay… what things can be ‘sniped’ with 5s(!) incoming? You have no lead indicator and mostly only the visual silhoutte. Even strafing should be enough to avoid such hits. Except destroyer maybe, but they are balanced as big targets.

Shield barrier mean, he have no hull regen. Mean every hull damage is his final nail. Second barrier have no resistance, which mean DPS is real DPS. Third he NEED to deploy it at the direction the shot come from. Mean at broadside multiple of them are needed. That at least an argument, but hardly unbalanced a) he need to even have this b) he have no hull regen then c) Your team will have it easier as he need at least 1 of his shields for you. This game isn’t solely balanced about 1 vs. 1.

a)you can have an lead indicator when you use the em main weapon with booster ammunition

b)you can’t strafe while using disintegrator

c)it is hard to see a photon coz you have the annoying blue overlay

d)when I would try to evade every projectile I couldn’t do anything coz of the disintegrator CD (I can’t move directly after going out / can only shoot after 3sec stadnig still, etc.)

e)it is easier to doge something you see(red lazor before you get hit) then something that is hard to detect

f)with your hull part you are right

a)you can have an lead indicator when you use the em main weapon with booster ammunition

b)you can’t strafe while using disintegrator

c)it is hard to see a photon coz you have the annoying blue overlay

d)when I would try to evade every projectile I couldn’t do anything coz of the disintegrator CD (I can’t move directly after going out / can only shoot after 3sec stadnig still, etc.)

e)it is easier to doge something you see(red lazor before you get hit) then something that is hard to detect

f)with your hull part you are right

a) You are on their radar = everyone see you.

If everyone see you = dead by torpedo of frigates or anomly from guard.

Tackler/Covert Ops can ambush you too. NO feature of destroyer. If that isn’t enough: Countersniper from ELRF/JLRF possible. Choosing to support your team by standing behind(maybe wide open) is balanced from being not able to react fast at incoming. And common: One hit should be possible for a LRF to survive!

d) What is with your main weapons. Accidently removed from your ship? A LRF isn’t just about their special module! Second: Maybe bad position choosen if you can’t hit other targets/be a long time open for the destroyer?

e) has nothing to do with this problem. For me photon are easy to see.