Interceptors are fastest, toughest and highest damage all at the same time.

Game Discussion PvP
41

10 minutes ago, Aetrion said:

Posting videos from November 2016 that show weapons that got nerfed so bad that nobody even uses them anymore is kind of dishonest don’t you think?

 

Also the idea that just because something goes faster and relies on constant use of active modules it’s more difficult to play is simply bogus. There are different kinds of difficulty, and one big one is how far ahead you have to plan in order to avoid bad situations. If your ship is extremely fast and has a lot of “oh sh*t” buttons you don’t need to plan very far ahead. If your ship is slow and can’t extricate itself from danger you need to plan very far ahead. If planning wasn’t difficult grand strategy games would be considered extremely easy, when in fact they are considered to be some of the most hardcore games there are. 

I think you missed the point, niripas tried to showcase the difference in game play. Destroyers game play is extremely simple, it is as you say, you plan for couple things, based on a game mode, map, and opponent (that is assuming Destroyer is even needed in that combination), get in position and then just wiggle your mouse, while drinking tea, while in interceptors if you are in a where close to 2+ enemies, you have to constantly evaluate your situation, with current game balance, most of the time you do not have time for “oh $hit” buttons because you are already dead, you have to constantly prevent that from happening while constantly being under fire from 2-5 times the range of your weapons and god knows how much AOE auto aim sources, that you simple can not directly dodge, only prevent.

 Ever heard of a term skill cap? Destroyers have extremely low skill cap to be effective, if average reaction and game experience and common sense you just fly into the battle and you contributing to your team, granted you need ok build, while in interceptor in order to be valuable to your team and not just frag by cd (exception a taikin/recons on beacon maps with all enemies in slow ships) you have put a lot of effort into flying.

 

PvP Games should never be balanced around acquisition effort, or arbitrary sizes or naming conventions, just because you are flying the “biggest and most expensive” ship does not automatically mean you are entitles to stomp on rest of the game without applying any effort, due to the ship not even providing the room to apply such effort. 

 

Another thing is don’t fly a same ship in every single battle, you have to learn when there is truly a need for a destroyer (or any other ship for that matter), because if you pick it in the wrong time you will simply amplify all the vulnerabilities of the destroyer, otherwise they are still very influential on the match outcome in rite situations, just like any other ship. 

 

Regardless of any of that, destroyers do need some “fixing”, not to the extend of what weaker players demand, but still, interceptors, especially CovOps are easily the weakest and least valuable class, most of the times, and if you are already have so much issues with them, maybe you should try flying one extensively and learn 1st hand their weaknesses. It is in general a good idea to fly everything, this way you can learn 1st hand strengths and weaknesses and how to exploit all of that when facing them.

42

5 hours ago, Aetrion said:

Posting videos from November 2016 that show weapons that got nerfed so bad that nobody even uses them anymore is kind of dishonest don’t you think?

Oh yes - the infamous Vacuum Resonance Nerf. The whole 10%. Or are you talking about Pulse Laser? Also:

4 hours ago, xKostyan said:

I think you missed the point, niripas tried to showcase the difference in game play.

That was my point exactly - I just took 2 videos that were on top of the lists, that’s it. 

43

The difference in gameplay does not showcase a difference in skill required, only a difference in the type of skill required.

 

I’m starting to see why this game is so dead though, this entire community has collapsed in on a few forum bullies who do nothing but ridicule anyone who doesn’t like it exactly the way it is because they want to stay the big fish in the tiny tiny pond. There is no fixing it until the devs stop listening to you guys. 

44

You are not seeing the whole picture here, there is more to this game than meets the eye, the game as it is its not perfect, no game is, but its not that bad either and I can say for a fact that the “bullies” are people trying to explain you how it works, noone here is a full on fanboy that thinks the game is perfection and anyone who is against it is a numbskull, and noone around here has complete control of it, whatever happens behind the scenes can be beyond even to the ones in the highest positions, any constructive criticism is welcome, its not your glitz and glamour League of Legends or Overwatch with an inflated community that is nothing but complete toxicity, I’d much rather have a smaller but more content community than a large trash fanbase.

And if you really have a worthy idea then go ahead and give the devs a reason to listen to you.

45

What I’m saying has a very simple premise: The mechanics of the game do not line up with its aesthetics. It’s far too easy for a big ship to get dismantled in seconds by a fighter or interceptor, and there are no meaningful counterplays because you are too big and slow to dodge anything, and you have very little other active gameplay that lets you defend yourself. The result is a game where it frequently feels like small ships do more damage and have better survivability than large ships, even if all the base stats on large ships are better.

46

21 hours ago, Aetrion said:

Also the idea that just because something goes faster and relies on constant use of active modules it’s more difficult to play is simply bogus. There are different kinds of difficulty, and one big one is how far ahead you have to plan in order to avoid bad situations. If your ship is extremely fast and has a lot of “oh sh*t” buttons you don’t need to plan very far ahead. If your ship is slow and can’t extricate itself from danger you need to plan very far ahead. If planning wasn’t difficult grand strategy games would be considered extremely easy, when in fact they are considered to be some of the most hardcore games there are. 

Then demonstrate how easy it is to use inties, by actually using them instead of wastign our time here ranting about imbalance between ship types that donesn’texist

 

I am just saying the Performance peak rises with increasing difficulty of mastering a ship… that’s how it is in EVERY game. The harder somethign is to master, the more rewarding is it to actually master something. (now if i know what games you play besides star conflict i could give you a example you might understand)

 

39 minutes ago, Aetrion said:

What I’m saying has a very simple premise: The mechanics of the game do not line up with its aesthetics. It’s far too easy for a big ship to get dismantled in seconds by a fighter or interceptor, and there are no meaningful counterplays because you are too big and slow to dodge anything, and you have very little other active gameplay that lets you defend yourself. The result is a game where it frequently feels like small ships do more damage and have better survivability than large ships, even if all the base stats on large ships are better.

That is simply not the case. A well fit guard can face tank 8 people for 30 seconds or so till it falls apart (that’s a lot of damage) try facetanking just one player in an inty (Pro tip: you die)

 

What do you think should happen, when a minigun hits a truck? Should it remain standing as it is because it looks sturdy, or would it be destroyed?

Or if you try to shoot a goldfish with a minigun? Should it die because you aimed at it? Or should it live, because not a single bullet did hit?

47

What if a minigun hits a tank? Should it blow up just because it sounded like rain inside?

48

1 hour ago, Aetrion said:

What if a minigun hits a tank? Should it blow up just because it sounded like rain inside?

Right, and heavy armored units obviously are not vulnerable to any armaments that can be carried out by a single person… sure…

49

That’s hardly the point is it? The point is every day when I play conquest there are teams of all interceptors that can run bombs with impunity because they can dodge 90% of everything thrown at them by just wiggling their ship back and forth while planting explosives, and if they do get bored and decide to actually attack your destroyer they just come out with a plasma arc and destroy all of your modules before you can even say wormhole.

 

I mean you want to talk about specialized weapons? How about I get some specialized weapons to deal with interceptors and gunships? How about some flak shells with proximity fuses that make them as big a target as I am? None of that “needs to hit a wall behind them to do splash damage” nonsense either, they could do better than that in WW1 already. 

50

2 minutes ago, Aetrion said:

That’s hardly the point is it? The point is every day when I play conquest there are teams of all interceptors that can run bombs with impunity because they can dodge 90% of everything thrown at them by just wiggling their ship back and forth while planting explosives, and if they do get bored and decide to actually attack your destroyer they just come out with a plasma arc and destroy all of your modules before you can even say wormhole.

 

I mean you want to talk about specialized weapons? How about I get some specialized weapons to deal with interceptors and gunships? How about some flak shells with proximity fuses that make them as big a target as I am? None of that “needs to hit a wall behind them to do splash damage” nonsense either, they could do better than that in WW1 already. 

IF you are getting overrun by interceptors in conquest, that simply means that your team is plain terrible, there are just way too many tools to completely shut down interceptor swarms in dread battles. Or do you perhaps playing solo in conquest vs 8 man teams?

51

8 hours ago, Aetrion said:

That’s hardly the point is it? The point is every day when I play conquest there are teams of all interceptors that can run bombs with impunity because they can dodge 90% of everything thrown at them by just wiggling their ship back and forth while planting explosives

Use tacklers. Tacklers, sir. Tacklers is your answer. Did I mention tacklers? Oh and 1 recon. And Tacklers.

52

2 hours ago, OwnageMaster said:

Use tacklers. Tacklers, sir. Tacklers is your answer. Did I mention tacklers? Oh and 1 recon. And Tacklers.

guards work too with their slowing field, plus all ships have access to a couple beam weapons, i’ve said it all before, this guy just has no idea, leave him,

53

15 hours ago, xKostyan said:

IF you are getting overrun by interceptors in conquest, that simply means that your team is plain terrible, there are just way too many tools to completely shut down interceptor swarms in dread battles. 

 

If the only way to counter interceptor swarms is to use specific ships to counter them that absolutely proves my point about them being overpowered and creating a metagame that everyone has to bend to if they want a chance in PvP.

 

That’s exactly what isn’t fun about this game in its current state.

54

Going by your logic a solider should be able to take down a tank by using an assault rifle, there is something called counters, no ship class is good against everything, its a circle of classes that are better against others, having ECMs being able to easily take down guards would be fun for you?

55

4 minutes ago, xXThunderFlameXx said:

Going by your logic a solider should be able to take down a tank by using an assault rifle, there is something called counters, no ship class is good against everything, its a circle of classes that are better against others, having ECMs being able to easily take down guards would be fun for you?

If only ppl could think the same thing about destroyers…

56

9 minutes ago, Aetrion said:

 

If the only way to counter interceptor swarms is to use specific ships to counter them that absolutely proves my point about them being overpowered and creating a metagame that everyone has to bend to if they want a chance in PvP.

 

That’s exactly what isn’t fun about this game in its current state.

So are you saying that if to counter swarm of interceptors (let’s make it 8) you need 2 tacklers - then the interceptors are OP? Ok I will elaborate. Tacklers are helpful to stop interceptor swarms - they are DESIGNED to do so, so they are OPTIMAL choice. You don’t NEED them. Any gunship has access to slowing modules as well if you have a troubles with hitting fast, agile targets (oh, there is even a topic about specific builds for counter fast, agile targets). Basically this game is based on rock-paper-scissor concept - everything has a optimal counter. Someone even gave you a full group composition to counter full interceptor wings. You don’t see 8 tacklers vs 8 interceptors. 

 

Also if ANY ship could counter interceptors then that would mean that they are just useless. 

 

PS. Still don’t know if you are trolling.

57

4 hours ago, Aetrion said:

If the only way to counter interceptor swarms is to use specific ships to counter them that absolutely proves my point about them being overpowered and creating a metagame that everyone has to bend to if they want a chance in PvP.

 

That’s exactly what isn’t fun about this game in its current state.

There are super easy ways to increase your chance against inteceptor swarm… (even if you are so narrow minded and must stick with Frigates and Destroyers, which is dumb by the way)

1.Play better

2.Pulsar

3.Mass Populsion inhibitor

4.Masking module

5.Em Torpedo

6.Minelayer

7.Increase projectile speed

8.Don’t go alone

 

58

7 hours ago, xXThunderFlameXx said:

Going by your logic a solider should be able to take down a tank by using an assault rifle, there is something called counters, no ship class is good against everything, its a circle of classes that are better against others, having ECMs being able to easily take down guards would be fun for you?

 

This game isn’t balanced on a system of counters though.

 

Just because one ship has the ability to look a target, decide it must die and make it happen with ease doesn’t mean that’s balanced by simply calling it a counter when the ships it’s doing this to don’t have the same relationship to anything else. 

 

For example, why do destroyers get slapped with a huge penalty to respawn times that is absolutely crippling in objective based PvP if it’s a system of counters? In a game of rock paper scissors you can’t just slap a penalty on playing rock and say it’s still a balanced system. 

 

Also, please lay out what counters what if it’s just a system of counters, because I’m pretty sure you can’t come up with a clear relationship of counters for every class of ship in the game.

59

1 hour ago, Aetrion said:

For example, why do destroyers get slapped with a huge penalty to respawn times that is absolutely crippling in objective based PvP if it’s a system of counters? In a game of rock paper scissors you can’t just slap a penalty on playing rock and say it’s still a balanced system. 

2

Because destroyers are THAT influential, and if flown by an experienced player can single-handedly win you a beacon match.

60

1 hour ago, Aetrion said:

For example, why do destroyers get slapped with a huge penalty to respawn times that is absolutely crippling in objective based PvP if it’s a system of counters? In a game of rock paper scissors you can’t just slap a penalty on playing rock and say it’s still a balanced system. 

Gravi lense… That one is reason enough… i could of course go more in depth from there on, but mentioning this one module makes our point pretty clear.

 

As xKostyan and many others stated… a well flown destroyer can decide beacon matches in favor of their teams easily. Of course if you have no idea what you doing with your destroyer and rush in head on with a vigilant or camp at 8km with halo launcher, you just deserve the additional respawn time to be that stupid in using a ship. (Not saying i haven’t done that… but i learn from my mistakes)