Yes it’s relative, but it’s also true there is no situation where shield tanking beats hull tanking. As such, Empire ships are often objectively better.
Yes it’s relative, but it’s also true there is no situation where shield tanking beats hull tanking. As such, Empire ships are often objectively better.
Do you consider adaptative shields as shield tanking? then yeah, in interceptors it is better to have adaptatives than hull tanking if you know how to use it.
Do you consider adaptative shields as shield tanking? then yeah, in interceptors it is better to have adaptatives than hull tanking if you know how to use it.
If you have Adaptives you suppose to HULL tank with them
Jericho commands arent “situational” or “niche”, EVERYTHING Empire commands do better (Except T4 Flamberge, but its a just a buff bot, and hardly any threat in actual combat. And Sword S, due to its r15 and higher passive dmg bonus than empire, could be pumped all the way into the dmg and have higher mg than Aura, but you will be paper thin and other ships do much-much better at that role (i.e. long range dmg))
If you have Adaptives you suppose to HULL tank with them
Jericho commands arent “situational” or “niche”, EVERYTHING Empire commands do better (Except T4 Flamberge, but its a just a buff bot, and hardly any threat in actual combat. And Sword S, due to its r15 and higher passive dmg bonus than empire, could be pumped all the way into the dmg and have higher mg than Aura, but you will be paper thin and other ships do much-much better at that role (i.e. long range dmg))
No, you are not supposed to hull tank with them. You are supposed to speed tank with them. And they are shield passives, so they count as shield tank.
The problem is that playing buffer tank with the shields is difficult, since the all around resistance module works with speed, and jerrys are not made for speed.
And no, empire commands don’t do everything better. They do better than on some situations, and worse in some others.
No, you are not supposed to hull tank with them. You are supposed to speed tank with them. And they are shield passives, so they count as shield tank.
The problem is that playing buffer tank with the shields is difficult, since the all around resistance module works with speed, and jerrys are not made for speed.
You speed tank your HULL with adaptives, since adaptives do hull and shield and take away shield modules, you are stacking up hull passives with adaptives, i.e. hull tank. Sure Shield is getting resist under the speed but its just an icing on a cake, you still tank in Hull and if you don’t you are doing it wrong. Good example Wakizashi AE (even though it is inferior to Storm Viking) if you are going to do adaptive tank on it, you will be doing Hull tanking due to signature size+armadillo+native interceptor dmg reductions, Another big part is if you have a command (in sec con) 99% that he will be running hull aura, and if he is running 4 role modules he is very passive command that does long/mid range and those are not much of a threat in smaller games.
And no, empire commands don’t do everything better. They do better than on some situations, and worse in some others.
If you compare strictly Emp to Jer commands, absolutely ignoring the rest of the game, there are couple things that Jericho could do better but only via huge sacrifices in other aspects of a command ship, and those cases are very-very limited, but when you try to implement those cases into an actual game, it is obvious that those cases are much better covered by different ship roles whatsoever, and in order to have Jericho with that “niche” build in the team you have to overcompensate with different roles and team compositions, and gains from those niche build for the team vs sacrifices it has to do are very doubtfully “worth it”. While you take an Empire command, every “serious” and not some trollolol build incorporates in a team composition and synergizes with pretty much everything else around.
So no, as i said except those 2 ships from my previous posts, there are no other Jericho Commands that should be even remotely considered in any team with half a brain. And even those 2 with those niche builds hardly worth the effort and better replaced with different roles
Jericho Commands have a potential to be different, but there are have to be more game balance tweaks for that, at this moment, when you take into consideration “everything” available, popular and effective in teh game, they are simply worse, not niche or situational, worse.
You speed tank your HULL with adaptives, since adaptives do hull and shield and take away shield modules, you are stacking up hull passives with adaptives, i.e. hull tank. Sure Shield is getting resist under the speed but its just an icing on a cake, you still tank in Hull and if you don’t you are doing it wrong. Good example Wakizashi AE (even though it is inferior to Storm Viking) if you are going to do adaptive tank on it, you will be doing Hull tanking due to signature size+armadillo+native interceptor dmg reductions, Another big part is if you have a command (in sec con) 99% that he will be running hull aura, and if he is running 4 role modules he is very passive command that does long/mid range and those are not much of a threat in smaller games.
So instead of using the hull slots for energy regen or hull regen, or better speed, you are wasting them in pasive resists that only apply to 1/3rd of your total HP?
I suppose each one has his own ways…
So instead of using the hull slots for energy regen or hull regen, or better speed, you are wasting them in pasive resists that only apply to 1/3rd of your total HP?
I suppose each one has his own ways…
No you still use your hull slots for w/e current needs there could be, but even with those speed hull with adaptives > shield speed with adaptives tanking, even on jericho interceptors. And that 1/3rd of HP will keep you alive longer than other 2/3rd.
It is more properly to say that speed adaptive tanking either full on hull, or major Hull tank with supplementary of shields, and based on this you should choose your multipurpose modules as well to finish the proper tanking.
Another major thing that a lot of people ignore is that dmg done to shields goes through to hull if there is more dmg than shields. Shield signature is 1.5x -2x bigger than hull signature, i.e. that much easier to hit that target. So it is very often (especially on interceptors) it is much better to have no shields and smaller hitbox, than a little shields and much bigger hitbox. And this is one of the huge reasons why Mass shield generator is not worth it with current balance.
And this is what makes this game beautiful. Actually having options.
And this is what makes this game beautiful. Actually having options.
But some options are clearly superior to others.
But some options are clearly superior to others.
Not precisely. For example i’ve been toying last night with shield + speed tanking on Fed fighters. While it is indeed true you cannot sit and shoot with shield tanking, it works quite nice with speed, because you go in, do some damage, take only a bit of damage because you speed tank, your shields do go down pretty fast, but you can run away and regen them pretty fast, faster than the hull anyway, and come for another pass. I’m sure it’s not perfect theory for SQ or whatever, but in randoms it does quite nicely. With Empire hull tanking you can give some and take some, but unless you’re in a gunship you don’t have a lot of the hit and run option. With Fed shield tanking, you usually have the time to run away, even from inties. Maybe you can’t outrun them with 500ish speed, but you can get fast enough to a clump of friendly frigs. Also, the shield recharger thing has a quite short cooldown.
While some options will ALWAYS be superior to others (like for example, you do have the option to make a really non synergistic build that allows you to stay in the respawn screen half the fight), it’s nice that there are several valid builds for ships, and not only THE ONE.
Can’t talk about Jerry shield tanking builds tho, they do suck in my opinion (Jerry in general, only inties are decent) :yes_yes:
Can’t talk about Jerry shield tanking builds tho, they do suck in my opinion (Jerry in general, only inties are decent) :yes_yes:
this is a whole point of this thread, which ship line is the worst, and it is a Jericho Command
this is a whole point of this thread, which ship line is the worst, and it is a Jericho Command
Pfff you are right, and all posts on the forum are on topic, right?
I was just taking the opportunity to praise the game a bit for allowing us several good build options and not only one or two, as most games do, per class. Specially when you can surely build a gunship differently than another gunship, depending on it’s bonuses/stats. In most MMO’s with customization elements, there are only standard builds, that you can’t diverge from without losing practicality. Here, the build is very related with an individual’s play style. And it’s awesome.
P.S. If all this ain’t true and there are only 1-2 perfect builds for each ship, I don’t care, because the game gives me the illusion of customization freedom and I value it a bunch for it
In most MMO’s with customization elements, there are only standard builds, that you can’t diverge from without losing practicality. Here, the build is very related with an individual’s play style. And it’s awesome.
P.S. If all this ain’t true and there are only 1-2 perfect builds for each ship, I don’t care, because the game gives me the illusion of customization freedom and I value it a bunch for it
SC’s customization isn’t the best I’ve seen. Not bad, but IMO it could be better. Adaptive shield in particular is a case in point. Let’s say you have one shield and one hull slot only: the Jericho ship loses out immediately when you compare it to an Empire ship, because the Jeri ship only has one slot for the bulk of its tank while the Empire ship gets to benefit from both slots.
Pfff you are right, and all posts on the forum are on topic, right?
I was just taking the opportunity to praise the game a bit for allowing us several good build options and not only one or two, as most games do, per class. Specially when you can surely build a gunship differently than another gunship, depending on it’s bonuses/stats. In most MMO’s with customization elements, there are only standard builds, that you can’t diverge from without losing practicality. Here, the build is very related with an individual’s play style. And it’s awesome.
P.S. If all this ain’t true and there are only 1-2 perfect builds for each ship, I don’t care, because the game gives me the illusion of customization freedom and I value it a bunch for it
There are not. You can fly the same ship in different configurations, to do different things and cover different nichés in the battlefield.
From experience I can say that, for example, a Katana S can’t tank **** compared to a Prom X, but at least it’s a very fast and fun ship, and you can make some interesting builds with it, but don’t expect to get too many Fear Me medals.
From experience I can say that, for example, a Katana S can’t tank **** compared to a Prom X, but at least it’s a very fast and fun ship, and you can make some interesting builds with it, but don’t expect to get too many Fear Me medals.
Problem is PromX has passive 10% speed bonus and both have only 1 engine slot, similar to what Katana has, final AB speed is about 20 difference between those ships. You can make a speed boat out of PromX easily and still have some tanking and higher dmg.
Imo the only “true” shield tanks left viable are guards, and its a very fiddly build.
Imo the only “true” shield tanks left viable are guards, and its a very fiddly build.
Jerry ECM and CO are doing fine with adaptatives!
Jerry ECM and CO are doing fine with adaptatives!
true shield tanks are those that sit and take it, im not referring to any ceptors, to me they dont count
Hull tanking on a ceptor is downright deadly…