I just played my first two games today now that the first win of the day system has been added. My first game was a domination mode that we lost in about 8 minutes. Total faceroll. I got maybe 1 kill, 3 assists, and no medals. This match rewarded me with 39007 credits, 1160 experience, 1023 reputation, and 1023 loyalty. My second match was a detonation that we won when the timer ran out, not by EMPing all 3 beacons. I played this match in the same ship, got about 7 kills, 15 assists, and numerous medals. This match (which should have given double the reputation and loyalty as normal due to first win of the day) gave me 36434 credits, 7431 experience, 2047 reputation, and 2047 loyalty.
You would think that for a win you would get more credits as well as more reputation and loyalty. Yet I got less credits, and before the double reputation and loyalty bonus from the first win of the day, I got exactly 0.5 (what?) more reputation and loyalty. I did get more experience, but I don’t really care about that. What I want to know is how it makes sense to be given almost identical, if not LESS rewards for winning, then for losing. Especially if your performance in the win was better (to negate any arguments about that).
I would love some kind of explanation of how the rewards are calculated. This system seems to be poorly thought out, bugged, or just blatantly unfair based on the numbers from these 2 games.
Although I don’t have a clear view of it myself, from what I’ve heard your reward depends on how well you did in relation to your team. If you lose the game, but you were way better than everyone on your team, you get lots of credits/xp. If you did mediocre and won, you won’t get as much. At least that is what I think.
Well I listed my score for the game that I lost, and I did terribly. I was in like, 9th place on my team yet got almost the exact same rewards as when I was in 3rd place when we won. So score apparently does not matter.
Credits aren’t a massive factor in the skill/reward ratio. It’s mainly about the rep and experience. Notice how your rep doubled and your experienced got a x7 multiplier on it. Credits aren’t a focused reward because you can trade their RL cash money for credits or using the license program. Business 101 in the f2p model.
I don’t care much about the exp on my ships since they are all tier 2s and I buy new ones every few hours. I don’t care about much about the credits from PvP since you get waaaay more from scenarios. I suppose I should have been as specific as possible so I did not confuse anyone.
According the the patch notes, a first win of the day bonus has been added. This bonus was stated to double the amount of reputation and loyalty that you gain for the first game you win every day. Now then, my very first game today was a LOSS, meaning no first win bonus. This loss gave me 1023 reputation. My next game was a WIN, and this win was my first win of the day. Therefore, unless the feature that was supposedly just added does not work, the amount of reputation I earned for this game should have been double the amount I would have normally gotten for winning. I got 2047 reputation for this win. True, that is double what I got for my loss. However, if the first win of the day feature is working properly, that would mean that if that had been say, my 7th win today, I would have gotten 1023.5 reputation. Since this WAS the first win, that 1023.5 would have been doubled to 2047.
The fact that without the first win of the day doubling the reputation, I would have essentially gotten the EXACT same amount of reputation for losing a game as I did for winning a game makes no sense at all. 1023 for losing, 1023.5 for winning. However, the fact that there is that random 0.5 reputation also does not make sense. So from the numbers after these 2 matches I can conclude one of two things.
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The reputation you receive after a match has nothing to do with your score, the time taken to complete the match, or if you won or lost.
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The first of the day system is broken, and I should have received 4094 reputation from the game I won.
You would think that for a win you would get more credits as well as more reputation and loyalty.
You get a massive amount of credits as it is dubbling them as is would be extreamly op. im only in teir two and om average get 75k plus per match and with ships costing just over 800k thats not bad at all.
What you totally forget is, when you win you get a chance at green and purple items, which at tier2 are worth around 140k (green) and not even buyable for purple ones.
In the credit department you also forgot to add the 1-5 trashloot items which again are worth about 5k to 12k per item.
So… enuff of the crying.
You folks sure don’t follow what OP want to say, do you? Reading with comprehension is a rare skill these days indeed.
He’s not “crying” about too low rewards or the credits being a problem but noticing either lack of consistency in rewards or bugged behaviour of the new 2x bonus for 1st win system.
if Lost game gives you 1023 reputation and 1023 loyalty.
and
Win game gives you 1023 reputation and 1023 loyalty.
then
there’s apparently something odd in reward system, no?
@OP - from my understanding of things reward depends on how well you did in relation to your team. So there could be a situation where all of you in that game you won performed almost equally well (so each member of the group had similar stats to yours (i.e. all of you scored ~1000-1030 points), while in the game you lost there was a huge gap or overall terrible performance of the team (?).
Obviously devs won’t be keen to show us exact formula for calculating rewards (as such knowledge could be easily abused) but indeed same reward for winning and loosing is baffling.
Unless it’s some pure weird coincidence - it would be interesting to track few more games and see how much rewards deviate from game to game according to not only your performance but also other players in your team.
Finally someone actually read what I posted and was able to comprehend it rather than just skim it and guess at what I was saying.
I have said across multiple posts that I don’t really care about the credits. I don’t really care about the EXP. Those are the two easiest things to get.
I am mostly concerned with the reputation and loyalty. Just as Oxia said, I am noticing a lack of consistency or a bug with the first win of the day system.
@Oxia Since you seem to be the only one who actually understands what I am talking about, I suppose I will direct this at you. I figured that the rewards were based on my performance in some way. Even so, the system still makes no sense. If I go by your example, then that is even more reason why I should have gotten more reputation for my win than for my loss. In the loss, I was not even in the top 5 on my team in terms of points. The highest points anyone on that team got was about 470. The lowest anyone got was 80. I had around 200. In the match I won, I was in the top 5 with a point total of around 1300. The highest points was 1470ish. The lowest points was in the 500’s. 3 of the 5 people in the top 5 had over 1000 points. 2 of them had scores in the 900s. Everyone else on the team had scores between 800ish and 500ish. To make the numbers as easy possible, let’s say the lowest score was 500 and the highest was 1500. That would make the average score of the team 1000. I scored 1300, which is well above the average.
So in the match I lost, my score was right around the team average. In the match I won, my score was well above the average. However, even though my score was much better compared to the average in the game I won, I still received the same reputation for that match as I did in the match were my performance was much worse.
I am strongly considering compiling a list of data from all of my matches from now on in order to see just what the reward ratio between games I win and lose are, as well as how your score actually affects your rewards, if it even does at all. At the moment, the reward system makes absolutely no sense at all.
I did a quick research on the subject and noted Reputation and Loyalty check through 10 random games, arcade mode in T1 ship. Every game - no matter if won or lost and no matter what score or position I had on the board and no matter what type - gave me exactly 1023 R and 1023 L
That’s with Extended Licence (50% bonus to both). XP and Credits gain was - as expected - different for each game and varied according to my score/position and overall team performance.
While I understand that such system might favour Cap role in Combat Recon game (they usually have lowest score due to constant hiding from the threat) - it also creates huge field for exploit and bot farming - it’s enough to just join the game, idle in the corner and earn exact same amount of Loyalty and Reputation without any contribution to the overall performance of the team.
While someone could argue that L and R are nothing without money and XP gain - it makes double bonus for 1st game won not much of a treat as it only applies to Reputation and Loyality after all.
Assuming that the Reputation and Loyalty gain per match is a design choice and not a bug (with all possible consequences) - what at least should be changed is that “Daily 1st Victory Double Bonus” should apply to XP/Money and not Rep and Loyalty.
P.S.: With enough input and proper spreadsheet for game type / score/ overall team performance we could possibly figure out exact formula for XP and money gain calculation too, but those seems rather fair anyway and I don’t really see the need to do that as it might give some people too many ideas about how to exploit the reward system even more.
P.S.1.: I’d like to say sorry to the teams in those two games where I was idling to check if my theory is right…
EDIT: Funnily enough few minutes after I wrote this message I’ve been designated as a Captain in Combat Recon, scored 1st place with 1080 points (while next person after me had only 600) and received 2047 Reputation and 2047 Loyalty along with multiple medals. It wasn’t my 1st victory today, though. Which makes things slightly more complicated (maybe 1st person on the board gets 2x R&L? ) - but the point about possible idling for Reputation and Loyalty farming is still valid imho.
I compared all the wins I have screencapped with loyalty gains. All but six had the exact same rep/loyalty gains, and 3 of those six also had the same rep/loyalty gains.
From lowest to highest;
1810 x1
1929 x3
2047 x8
3017 x1 (possibly a first victory - 1508.5 without 2x)
3412 x1 (First Victory of the Day - would’ve been 1706 without)
Round time, game mode, kills/assists/caps, and eff. score seem to have had no significant influence on the scores - the 2047s vary wildly, whether it’s a combat recon round that lasted 2:22 and I got an eff. score of 680 with one kill and one assist - or a stellar, nail-biting domination round that lasted 7:25 with 3 kills, 6 assists, 6 beacon captures, and an eff. score of 2790. One of those 1929s? A Detonation round with 9 kills, 9 assists, and a grand total eff. score of 3600 (I bombed two of the stations in one life).
Consistent they ain’t.
@Arcalane Difficult to draw a conclusion without knowing what Tier of battles you are playing, though. Might be that in higher tier battles rep/loyalty gains are more varied.
On the other hand, at least in Tier 1 Arcade battles it seems that there is a flat rate (including Licence 50% bonus) 1023 for lost game and 1023 for victory. But then, I had a very good streak just recently and been at 1st place in 3 or so games (overall team performance/number of kills and length of the game varied) and got 2047 R&L.
Still - getting less Rep/Loyalty for better efficiency (1929R&L | 3600eff against 2047R&L | 680eff) sure is confusing.
Definitely some fairly detailed official info about how rewards are calculated would be nice…
i’ve alsor looked at my screenshots :
T1 victory : 2115
defeat no screenshot
T2 victory
2684 2829 and 2835 in domination
2716 in combat reconnaissance
2835 and 2829 in detonation
defeat 1464 1464 and 1417 in all modes
T3 victory 3307 in all modes
defeat 1653
T4 : no screenshot
The development bonus on your ship multiplies your rewards. If you are trying to figure out the formula please keep track of what rank of ship you are using, since the development bonus is (shipRank-1)*0.15, or +15% for each rank above first.
*edit* I just want to stress that I mean rank, and not tier. What tier you play in has no influence on non-loot rewards.
Yea I am a bit confused about the whole credit reward system myself. I pretty much Just try not to die since I get the same amount of credits each time however the more I die the more credits I lose due to ship repair!
@Arcalane Difficult to draw a conclusion without knowing what Tier of battles you are playing, though. Might be that in higher tier battles rep/loyalty gains are more varied.
All Tier 1. I’m still working on getting funds and ranks to properly outfit my Tier 2s before I dive into those battles.
The development bonus on your ship multiplies your rewards. If you are trying to figure out the formula please keep track of what rank of ship you are using, since the development bonus is (shipRank-1)*0.15, or +15% for each rank above first.
*edit* I just want to stress that I mean rank, and not tier. What tier you play in has no influence on non-loot rewards.
No, development reward bonus only affects Experience.
The development bonus on your ship multiplies your rewards. If you are trying to figure out the formula please keep track of what rank of ship you are using, since the development bonus is (shipRank-1)*0.15, or +15% for each rank above first.
*edit* I just want to stress that I mean rank, and not tier. What tier you play in has no influence on non-loot rewards.
Indeed you might be into something, as I jumped into battle using by mistake the most basic (the one you unlock for 1Credit) Jericho fighter and got only ~700 (can’t recall exact number) R and L for lost game. Not sure if piloting different ship than your contracted faction counts towards it but that would confirm what you just said.
Still when I’m piloting my fully developed Lynx-M in T1 Arcade I always get either 1023 or 2047 R&L.
I’m actually considering to do a spreadsheet when I have some spare time at the office (might be tomorrow) but it would be great help if you guys propose what kind of variables we should take into consideration.
As a side note - it’s surprising there’s so few theory-crafting threads on English forum, not to mention threads covering some strategy guides (even some basic dogfighting / squad tactics guide would be pretty useful for many people I guess). I understand the game is new and there are still constant tweaks in every patch - but I guess it would be handy to start working on some subjects already?
Most of my fights nowadays are done in a Dvergr Knight, though a couple of rounds (that have also scored 2047/2047 win / 1023/1023 loss) have been in a Lynx-M that I decided to try out whilst I’m working on subfaction rep for unlocking components to outfit my T2s.
What you totally forget is, when you win you get a chance at green and purple items, which at tier2 are worth around 140k (green) and not even buyable for purple ones.
In the credit department you also forgot to add the 1-5 trashloot items which again are worth about 5k to 12k per item.
So… enuff of the crying.
Reading comprehension fail, Mr. Hardass.
And yeah, win/loss is basically irrelevant as far as rewards go, it’s like a 2-sided dice is rolled at the end of a fight to see what you get.