Beta-2 cache roll broken

[67330644]

Hey,
to me it appears your “dice” are broken on the beta-2 cache.
I’m sure it’s no a conincidence that very desireable components share this lootbox. However, the visuals indicate
that “Clip Coilgun 7-9” and “Rotary Gear Tempest Launcher 7-9” (white color indicator) have a much lower chance to drop than the other three
which are all “light-blule”. Hold that htought… so there is a weighted 2:3 chance to get either, assume 5/100 for the white, which leaves 90/100 for the 3 light-blues.
How come then, that in 10+ boxes I get 1 Thi’Lith (light-blue) and 9+ Dag’tnith (light blue) ?. If I had to bet on this, it’s nearly impossible…ok (30/100 times 9+,at least not 0 :o)
That to me hints to a possible issue, either with the odds or the visual indicators. Given all light blue items are MK5 blueprints, I don’t see why they should have different odds.

Needless to say, that since you chose to make Destro weapons to be level-up type (one needs Coilgun on a lvl 8 destro, before you can get it on a lvl 11, next step for level 14) it is essential
to grind for these apparently very rare drops. You can dash out as many discounts on Lvl 14 destro parts, but it’s unattractive to go all the way if all you get is no modules and the ordinary
gun only. So either set the players expectation correctly or fix your odds - the way it is, it’s only one thing: frustrating. In addition it further contributes to destroying the trade which is basically 100GS for mostly everything (because that is the minimum limit enforced), but those 3-5 key components where the odds seems very infavorable.

 

Grind is fine to a certain extend, but since you a) put a cap on the attempts and the caches are available to rotating hours, only the players with MUCH (flexible) time at their hands get the box. But then they are slapped in the face by seemingly unbalanced odds. This is how you make players walk away…or have a loooong patience untill the accumulated enough GS to buy such gear
for 1000GS+. Oh ya, right, why not top my GS with some $ - because the value I get doesn’t justify it for me.

 

[17324559]

20 hours ago, UtakoMurnanok said:

How come then, that in 10+ boxes I get 1 Thi’Lith (light-blue) and 9+ Dag’tnith (light blue) ?. If I had to bet on this, it’s nearly impossible…ok (30/100 times 9+,at least not 0 :o)
That to me hints to a possible issue, either with the odds or the visual indicators. Given all light blue items are MK5 blueprints, I don’t see why they should have different odds.
 

I tried only 3 times and got Rotary Gear, Ion Emmitter and Clip: Coil Gun respectively. 

 

20 hours ago, UtakoMurnanok said:

This is how you make players walk away…or have a loooong patience untill the accumulated enough GS to buy such gear
for 1000GS+. 

I’ve sold both whites for 400GS together, no one wanted to give more and looks like they are in constant supply.

 

As a (small) help - there are 10 Beta caches with one hour rotation time, so you can calculate when the next desired one will pop up.

[67330644]

Well let’s swap dice then. While I’m really happy for you to get 2 whites with just 3 attempts I’d put the odds close to “hard to believe”.
Either way, we can play yes/no all day. If you state the calculation is fine then I just have to accept that it does not for me. I can provide statistics for my next 10 attempts.

400GS for those two particular whites I have never seen in the past 4 weeks. I responded to several “WTS” players but none would accept less than 800GS. The lowest posted offer I saw was 950. They are in constant supply, for 4 digit numbers. I’m usually looking in the first half of EMEA days, most days of the week.

So next time you have a “golden dice” , ping me and I’ll give you 400GS for each ”)
I’d love to hear from other players…
 

[17324559]

Beta-8, 3 games in a row,

Meson Cannon 11

Gauss Cannon 10

Barrel: Coilgun R7-R9

 

Two whites in 3 tries.

I was missing Meson Cannon 11 BP and Gauss. 

Spoiler

 

 

 

For purchases the best time is around 3-5PM GMT - people were offering Rotary Gear and clip for less than 500. I purchased one blueprint that was eluding me for quite a time (Overclocked Blaster R17) for a 100 GS even when min listed price was still 500 GS. 

[67707542]

20 hours ago, UtakoMurnanok said:

I’d love to hear from other players…

 

Welp, story of my life, oppened like 10 of beta-2 never got the clip. Basically always getting the same blueprints all the time. So had to buy it from some else. 

 

Caches RNG are broken in my opinion and for a new player Iridium is not that easy to get.

 

Off topic:

 

20 hours ago, UtakoMurnanok said:

Well let’s swap dice then. While I’m really happy for you to get 2 whites with just 3 attempts I’d put the odds close to “hard to believe”.
Either way, we can play yes/no all day. If you state the calculation is fine then I just have to accept that it does not for me. I can provide statistics for my next 10 attempts.

 

 

I’ll condemn myself for what I’m about to say, but this comment was so funny to me, since I have been checking practically all the topics of the forum and I have noticed that for niripa almost everything is perfect in the game, and even if 100 people say that something is wrong, for him those 100 people are wrong. It is not my intention to offend and I hope he does not get offended, but I have already noticed it a lot and I felt I should say it.

 

Cheers

[67330644]

Quote

Welp, story of my life, oppened like 10 of beta-2 never got the clip. Basically always getting the same blueprints all the time. So had to buy it from some else.

@SilverPhantom7: Thank you for comforting ,)

It’s not my intention to whine about “it’s too hard to get a certain item” - this is after all a PtW game (to me at least) and I know what I signed up for.
However, same as you allegedly, if the RNG returns the SAME outcome over a considerable number of attempts, instead of more or less evenly distributed, then doubts appear as to the state of the RNG.
Was it by chance the Dag’tnith launcher ?

My personal guess is, that some factor of the RNG is biased or badly designed (tings like: local time, language setting, seconds between acquiring and opening container …), so the entropy of the RNG is suffering. In laymen’s terms “the random is not random enough” 

I will document the next attempts and try to do things different, that is, not aquire the container and instantly opening it, I will let it lie around some minutes maybe. That was the ONLY time I got something different from the Beta-2.

[@niripas](< base_url >/index.php?/profile/244639-niripas/) Since you document results for Beta-8 cache, does that imply the RNG is the same for ALL Beta containers ? What are the odds for white’s compared to light-blues then ?
Mind that we specifically referred to the Beta-2. Do you test on the live servers or other instance ?

 

[17324559]

4 hours ago, SilverPhantom7 said:

 

I’ll condemn myself for what I’m about to say, but this comment was so funny to me, since I have been checking practically all the topics of the forum and I have noticed that for niripa almost everything is perfect in the game, and even if 100 people say that something is wrong, for him those 100 people are wrong.

Mate, you are so wrong on this one. Usually it goes like this:

Example: Waz’got deployment.

Topics: “you have to farm the same mission for hours to get drops!!!111oneoneone” “you need to play for 6 hours a day for 2 months to get a single Waz’got part!!11” 

Me: there has to be something easier. Let’s think. Collected one part for Waz’got in Open Space. Exception or rule? Checking logs “got some_wazgot_part from engineering container”. Whaaat? Hmmm… Research Station - engineering container. Hmmm… Let’s try something closer - Imperial Transport Hub. Engineering container. Respawn time 90 seconds. Respawn radius - roughly 10 kilometers, 6 spawn places. Got all parts for Waz’got in 11 hours of gameplay, most of the time spent on figuring out drop and spawn patterns.

Me  responding to those topics “There is a method to build a Waz’got in less than 12 hours of play time”. 30+ responses of “dev pet, troll, wallet warrior” before I was able to post a location map of the Imperial Transport Hub with marked places. Screw this. Shared with few friends.

 

Another example:

Deconstructor Cannon vs Frigate ships. Someone was saying that Deconstructor cannon can kill a frigate in 2 seconds. Well. Let’s build a frigate resistant to this gun. Resists are fine, but what about the direct-to hull damage (that was white at the beginning)?. Well collision compensator and 9-3 implant took care of that. Ship under test wasn’t receiving any direct to hull damage. My taikin was flying totally immune to collision damage as well, so I posted that. My Guard could literally mitigate the whole damage that covert ops was doing without orion just on emergency shield recharge. With Orion I had to activate shield booster and still had 15 seconds of total damage mitigation and then the whole shield to draw upon. Phase Suppressor had the same characteristics regarding crit and damage, but cut healing in half. So I posted those findings that against properly built guard, deconstructor cannon is just meh and Phase Suppressor is better, pointing out that against interceptors the deconstructor cannon has too much damage per shot. People read this as “niri is saying that deconstructor cannon is fine”. Not my fault that for some people art of reading is a lost skill.

 

Yet another one:

“drops from loot spots are fully random” 

For me they weren’t. Did 2400 missions myself with few friends, did some maths and statistics - posted findings on the forum with quick how-to maximize yield per time spent. 

 

Which gets us to:

4 hours ago, UtakoMurnanok said:

 Since you document results for Beta-8 cache, does that imply the RNG is the same for ALL Beta containers ? What are the odds for white’s compared to light-blues then ?
Mind that we specifically referred to the Beta-2. Do you test on the live servers or other instance ?

 

I am documenting all my caches from Beta to Gamma included. At this moment I documented 59 openings with 4 repeated ones (so 55 unique items from 59 openings). As you probably know - nothing below 1024 sample size can give you any proper statistical confidence. So I just posted my findings. Simple rule of thumb for me says “if you find something you don’t already know - learn it immediately, otherwise you will get another very same item”. If there is something strange going on Beta-2 - I have no knowledge on this, merely pointing out that unless the drop rates were manually set for this cache it should follow the rest from the beta series. Basically what happened with my example of Beta-8 was repeated with Beta-5 and Beta-7. In my spreadsheet I was literally ticking the boxes top to bottom (and the spreadsheet is a copy of listing from my Workshop not-learned blueprints). 

I am doing my testing on live server, I don’t have access to anything else. I’m just a player. 

[67330644]

Update: 3 loots, 2 rotary gear, one Dag’tnith BP - again.
but thanks to niripas I changed my testing. I let time pass between acquiring the container and opening it. I did this for the first and got a rotary gear.
Didn’t wait, so instantly opened it after acquiring it - Dag’tnith Blueprint
For the third - I waited again , got another rotary gear.

So maybe not a sufficient # tests, but a hint or superstition. I’ll grind Beta-1 next and apply same behavior. Ya I got the clip for 500GS…still - sigh.
Note: I DID learn the Blueprints before opening the containers - but still a useful hint…if this really plays into things , it’s a bug or questionable design - to me that is.

[26589155]

On 24. 4. 2018 at 10:09 PM, UtakoMurnanok said:

I’d love to hear from other players…

I got same as you. 7x Dagtnith luncher in row.

I will not mention that I had 22K iridium and I spent more then 10K for spec ops containers and I got zillion monocrystals and just three times I got elydium crystals in it.

Like game knew that I had so many Iridium …

Now I don’t even buy them any more.

Still got 7.7k of Iridium left.

 

Also you have to know that NIRIPAS is lucky guy here. He basically get everything that he need from first try.

[17324559]

On 4/27/2018 at 7:11 PM, GatoGrande said:

Also you have to know that NIRIPAS is lucky guy here. He basically get everything that he need from first try.

You wish. I am unluckiest person in this game. So I always have to look for patterns to avoid mindless grinding forever. I’m just good at finding patterns, that’s it. And first try? Hardly. If you want a guy that finds everything fast and avoids any grindwalls - ask Stalowy 

[26589155]

9 hours ago, niripas said:

You wish. I am unluckiest person in this game. So I always have to look for patterns to avoid mindless grinding forever. I’m just good at finding patterns, that’s it. And first try? Hardly. If you want a guy that finds everything fast and avoids any grindwalls - ask Stalowy 

What kind of pattern is this when some catch is active for one h and we can get five different things in it and play 3x for it and I get 3x same sh it in that catch in row?

Is this screw U players pattern?  

[17324559]

8 hours ago, GatoGrande said:

What kind of pattern is this when some catch is active for one h and we can get five different things in it and play 3x for it and I get 3x same sh it in that catch in row?

Is this screw U players pattern?  

Mate, if that question would be sincere I would gladly explain it to you. However I will not feed the troll. Language, saltiness - what happened to you, Sunny?

[26589155]

2 hours ago, niripas said:

Mate, if that question would be sincere I would gladly explain it to you. However I will not feed the troll. Language, saltiness - what happened to you, Sunny?

I don’t wish to argue with you since you have my respect, but everything I said was true. 

We can get 3x same container with equipment per day, every container have five things in it. 

And I get 3x same thing. 

No offence but I don’t know nice words to describe this. 

Tho I would like to know pattern to get different things from container. 

[67707542]

I have been doing cache gamma -7 for a while now, trying to get the [Blueprint ‘Photon Emitter 13’]. Already spent more than 3k iridium and nothing. So if you know a pattern to get it pls tell me. 

[29971313]

yeh been trying for a yr to get that [Blueprint ‘Photon Emitter 13’] over 10k iridium spent

 

almost as bad as trying to get the final part for an R17 ship again over 10k irridium used 

 

I now have 7 of every part but missing all the “computing chips”

[67707542]

Wao, then no hope for me then :C