ORCA1911

Star Conflict 1.6.2 (Discussion)

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Finally no more axons and dendrites. Well, the material requirement is still insane but at least this:

Quote

At the moment, it is a bit expensive, but in the future, the technology will be improved.

is giving me hope. I think that 20 instead of 200 would be a fair thing.

 

Also, I like how the "decor" things are quite accessible even for people who don't play the game that often.

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It used to be 200 battles, now its 200 + damage done in battles. There was a news post about it few patches ago.

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Ah xxxx... here we go again.

 

NEW UPDATE - SAME WALL OF TEXT. LET'S GO.

WAZ'GOT BUNDLE

Seriously stop it with this. You can almost f**king buy everything you need to grind for at this point.

 

CHILDREN'S DAY

T H I S E V E N T D O E S N T D O A N Y T H I N G. Older players can forcibly tank their rating from 8k to 7k by anchoring a few battles in low rank ships and wablammo suddenly free achievements for all. Yay!

 

CROSSOUT STUFF

Free cosmetics, especially those of a brand new category are a yay from me and probably everyone else, just hoping the event isn't a big 'ol cuck because you can't clock the 15 OS missions in one day.

 

ZE'TA PROGRESSION... CHANGES

WE. NEED. TO. TALK.

 

Alright so let's take a seat and look over WHAT THE F**K IS GOING ON.

 

So. With this update, the Ze'Ta progression effective freeze for maybe 60% of us was removed. You can turn the Axons and stuff into silicon batteries and processing blocks for a cost of Iridium.

That sounds good right?

It is.

Until you look at the new special module cost.

LHUr9eo.jpg

Those are some big numbers huh? 30 million credits to research the blueprint, 40 million for production, 2000 batteries, 2000 processing blocks and 300 monocrystals.

In the event you didn't realise... that's maybe too much. 

2000 Screened Batteries

Costs (according to basic merths that might be incorrect because I'm kinda sleepy): 6000 graphite ore and 12,000 Osmium ore.

Probably more credits than have ever been situated on one account.

2000 Processing Blocks

Costs (also according to basic merths that might be incorrect because I'm kinda sleepy): 16,000 silicon ore and 40,000 crystal shards.

WHY.

If you think this is possible to do without trading then I'd like to wish you luck and I'll check back in after maybe 5 years.

Looking at these numbers make me sick. Who approved this.

 

On a brighter note it is now possible again to progress your Ze'Ta without farming OS for module and modifiers to sell for standards and then just buying the materials since Neurons were removed from traditional node costs, so no more prestige is locked behind that.

 

On a darker note Ze'Ta is going to suffer the same fate as Waz'Got as actually being able to activate more nodes to increase your ship's rank to access the nodes you legitimately want to research is locked behind the special module which is going to require an immense amount of trading and OS farming. Yeah you should've slogged out the initial module cost.

 

Holy f**k writing that lowered my IQ by 40.

 

SECTOR CONQUEST

Yay?

 

LEAGUE CHANGES

This is kinda sp00py considering why friendly fire was globally disabled to begin with.

Leagues is still a highly competitive mode and the potential for friendly fire to sabotage allies whether intentionally or not still exists. Although at least on this scale it'd be a meme fuelled rampage moreso than eliminating randoms.

 

TRADING CHANGES

This seemed necessary despite my lack of knowledge in any shape  or form of how automation is affecting the trading market place. 

 

 

YAY.

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6 hours ago, TheDerpNukem said:

WAZ'GOT BUNDLE

Seriously stop it with this. You can almost f**king buy everything you need to grind for at this point.

 

 

It’s also worth mentioning they advertised a rank “5-9” Waz’Dum in the bundle, which they obviously forget they decreased (for no good reason) to rank 6-8… 

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6 hours ago, Exarus said:

 

It’s also worth mentioning they advertised a rank “5-9” Waz’Dum in the bundle, which they obviously forget they decreased (for no good reason) to rank 6-8… 

The Ellydium bundles just shouldn't be a thing at all. Ellydium and all the other craftables are supposed to be one of those things you gawk at as a new player and try to work your way towards them - not gawk at them and immediately check the store page and grab your credit card.

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enjoy your 640m credit cost for that one Ze'Ta node

enjoy your 256m credit cost for all the other nodes other than the spec mod node
enjoy your farming resource cap on crystal shards 4 times for 1 node

enjoy dying

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33 minutes ago, PapyMcBites said:

enjoy your 640m credit cost for that one Ze'Ta node

enjoy your 256m credit cost for all the other nodes other than the spec mod node
enjoy your farming resource cap on crystal shards 4 times for 1 node

enjoy dying

According to Targem this is the definition of fun.

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Yeah 100 monos per node was difficult, but this? This is just a wall. Not even a grind wall. Just a wall.

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I have a question about Fort Muerto

 

Now Fort Muerto sector by 50.000 gs --- my team fight, In list who can take sector was only few teams ---- no was pay2win, Tcors.

When finish time sector suddenly see pay2win 90.000 points, Tcors 32.000 points.

Where they play???  if no was them points by 20 min, 30, 40 min when was open sectors ??? --- only when sector end suddenly we see to they play!!!!!

Normaly every match we see progress every pvp sectors, why this corp progress was hide???

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3 hours ago, solopawelek said:

I have a question about Fort Muerto

 

Now Fort Muerto sector by 50.000 gs --- my team fight, In list who can take sector was only few teams ---- no was pay2win, Tcors.

When finish time sector suddenly see pay2win 90.000 points, Tcors 32.000 points.

Where they play???  if no was them points by 20 min, 30, 40 min when was open sectors ??? --- only when sector end suddenly we see to they play!!!!!

Normaly every match we see progress every pvp sectors, why this corp progress was hide???

P2w and tch are haxxors. Only way to explain it. XD

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Sad to admins - and creators of game no can explain this situactions........

Admins and creators of this game are only to ....... good look and  no have known how this game work????

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I was wondering when the sinks would appear for the basic building materials, although the prices are a bit too high for my taste, i suppose they will change it again with lesser requirements with time. For the common player zeta will be very hard to level but for the oldies its all the same since most have high caps on basic items.

 

Other than that, the update has some quite nice things, cant wait for the decor option finally, long overdue feature :)

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On 6/1/2019 at 3:44 PM, TheDerpNukem said:

WAZ'GOT BUNDLE

Seriously stop it with this. You can almost f**king buy everything you need to grind for at this point.

 

50k GS paint, 10k GS Pilgrim, Deluxe bundles, Ze'Ta. I don't want to bash anyone for their decisions. There's a reason why Ze'Ta is still behind a wall and I'm 100% sure that all last R16 and R17 ships will also be behind GS or resource wall. For Pilgrim it was 6 months, I suppose that for Ze'Ta it will be also at least 6 months before the amount of resource amount will be at least "acceptable". It was and is still impossible to unlock the new node without trading and looking at the amount of Ze'Tas with new resources and even the new modules, the tax from trading must be juicy. It will continue as long as people use the trading to get that insane amount of resources to unlock just one module.

 

After the Ze'Ta requirements will be lowered to reasonable level, they will either release stage 3 after very short time so entire show will begin again or they will release a R16/17 ship with early Pilgrim paywall. 

 

Anyway, about deluxe bundles again, every game has its walruses that will throw insane amount of money in it. Devs probably realized that they can inflate the prices insanely and offer tons of progress for huge amount of money. Games I played that offered instant progress were always pushing it more and more to the point that it wasn't simply worth to play without paying ~$100 at the start and at least half of monthly salary to mean something at the endgame. "Free to play" my ***. Destroyers, now Ellydium ships, I hope they won't start selling R15 ships or even R16/17.

 

 

Rant mode off, I can't wait to get my hands on the decor things and I also like showing all available assignments in all gamemodes.

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On 6/1/2019 at 2:44 PM, TheDerpNukem said:

 

ZE'TA PROGRESSION... CHANGES

WE. NEED. TO. TALK.

If you think this is possible to do without trading then I'd like to wish you luck and I'll check back in after maybe 5 years.

Looking at these numbers make me sick. Who approved this.

 

In the real world - who wanted to have nodes on Ze'ta unlocked - go them unlocked. With all those crazy neuron requirements (over 60 neurons for basic nodes only - by your math it should take 30 years, not 30 days as most got them in about a month) . Also - if you would at least read the news - you would notice that they said it is temporary. Why? Who had leftover dendrites and axons could dismantle them and get neurons over 30% cheaper than before (7 axons + 70 dendrites per each).

When the supply of  both will vanish - then probably will be a change in special node prices.

 

6 hours ago, Gon009 said:

Anyway, about deluxe bundles again, every game has its walruses that will throw insane amount of money in it. Devs probably realized that they can inflate the prices insanely and offer tons of progress for huge amount of money. Games I played that offered instant progress were always pushing it more and more to the point that it wasn't simply worth to play without paying ~$100 at the start and at least half of monthly salary to mean something at the endgame. "Free to play" my ***. Destroyers, now Ellydium ships, I hope they won't start selling R15 ships or even R16/17.

I would agree with you, but. Waz'got required 12h of gameplay to get. Tharga - you could get it in about 3 weeks for maybe half an hour of gameplay per day. Destroyers - both R8 and R11 - max week after the release. R14 dessies - they were harder to get, but IIRC you couldn't buy them. Now about the bundles - I don't mind them. If someone wants to spend hundreds of dollars on something that is actually part of the game itself (progress) - I say - fine with me. He will still not buy skills. And all Ellydium ships need them to do anything useful on the battlefield. And how exactly you want to pay devs salaries, btw? They have to sell something - even in F2P game. And please, don't compare SC to those mobile crap games, where even a skin for your castle costs $20-$100 and then it occurs it's just for the first level. And each level you have to pay another $20-$100. I'm looking at this from this perspective - I paid $100 for Mass Effect Andromeda. I got 90 hours of fun from it (and coop wasn't fun). I bought a Mauler and Nyx in Star Conflict. Got a 1000 hours fun from it. So spent ~$45. Got a Rockwell at the sale as well. Then earned some GS in game (remember that there are only some ships that require to  be purchased with real money, most of the premium ones you can buy for GS) and got most of the premiums as well.

 

Also no - unlocking the new Specmodule took 5-6 days if you joined people that were playing to get it. Far from "impossible". 

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While we're talking about impossible things, can we please get rid of bots in PvP once and for all.

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2 hours ago, TheDarkRedFox said:

While we're talking about impossible things, can we please get rid of bots in PvP once and for all.

Just get rid of beam cannons from bots and dump the damage bonus for Ellydium bois and we'd be fine tbh even tho kill farming bots regardless of what they spawn in is still pretty easy in a decent LRF.

But mostly get rid of beam cannon bois. I'd like to hit clearance 22 some time this decade.

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Ahh, here we go again.

3 hours ago, OwnageMaster said:

And how exactly you want to pay devs salaries, btw?

This is so old and silly argument I kept hearing in these games.

How they could get the salary? By creating accessible paid content like for example cosmetics. Paint options are crap and many people would be able to buy new interesting ones. Also, they could release more patterns, some decor things. But these things shouldn't be too expensive, not 50k GS crap. Current 500GS is also too much for paints but for things like decors maybe would be OK.

By making gamemodes more enjoyable so people would stay. Rock/Paper/Scissors balance makes PvP unenjoyable, you can't expect most people playing vs AI and PvE all the time and Open Space is a huge waste of opportunity. I'm not saying that it's easy to make the game more enjoyable, it's difficult, however there are game designers for things like that. If you just slap more microtransactions on a game that lacks gameplay for most players, it means that you don't really care about how players see your game.

Also by trying to keep players playing the game or even by getting new players. Yes, you can prevent players from quitting. The game isn't popular and more and more too expensive microtransaction crap will make a fraction of players quit. Also, the game will also have more reasons to be called Pay 2 Win or Pay 2 Progress and even less will come to the game.

More microtransactions without making players stay is only a short term solution. 

Games like Robocraft are excellent example of how good gameplay can keep your playerbase huge and that you need a good game designers for this. In case of Robocraft, they did the opposite, they created excellent initial gameplay but they didn't understand why players liked it, after years of bad changes it's a dying game now. Many F2P games show that you don't need anything else than cosmetic microtransactions if you design your game in a really good way.

SC is broken and they need to fix it to get more paying players instead to slap microtransactions everywhere to milk current low number of surviving players.

 

3 hours ago, OwnageMaster said:

And please, don't compare SC to those mobile crap games

No, I'm comparing the SC to games that were here for ~10 years. Like some GameForge games or even BigPoint games. These companies are famous for pushing microtransactions to the point that non-paying users don't have the reason to play. 

 

3 hours ago, OwnageMaster said:

I would agree with you, but. Waz'got required 12h of gameplay to get. Tharga - you could get it in about 3 weeks for maybe half an hour of gameplay per day.

12h of gameplay to get Every. Single. Node? I doubt it. This is what Deluxe gives. Entire tree, every module and weapon from the start. Tell me how many there are players with 100% unlocked trees here.

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Spoiler

TfTa1i8.jpg2x8zEZl.jpgsf7S32A.jpg

The decor thingies look nice tho :D

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Do they scale up for dessies or is it a game of the pin the tail on the donkey once more to spot customisations on a dessie? 

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33 minutes ago, TheDerpNukem said:

Do they scale up for dessies or is it a game of the pin the tail on the donkey once more to spot customisations on a dessie? 

gimme a sec

 

-nope, they dont scale, just get positioned at weird places but looks cool nonetheless, just a bit small 

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15 minutes ago, ORCA1911 said:

gimme a sec

 

-nope, they dont scale, just get positioned at weird places but looks cool nonetheless, just a bit small 

Ah well, so much for giant bull horns on my tyrant, but I guess it'll still be notable on the rest of my loadout

 

unrelated btw: Is the 11-17 Mk5 assault railgun using the correct model? The image in the atlas looks completely different and the mk5 model looks identical to the image for the 8-12 mk4 version

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7 hours ago, Gon009 said:

Ahh, here we go again.

This is so old and silly argument I kept hearing in these games.

How they could get the salary? By creating accessible paid content like for example cosmetics. Paint options are crap and many people would be able to buy new interesting ones. Also, they could release more patterns, some decor things. But these things shouldn't be too expensive, not 50k GS crap. Current 500GS is also too much for paints but for things like decors maybe would be OK.

By making gamemodes more enjoyable so people would stay. Rock/Paper/Scissors balance makes PvP unenjoyable, you can't expect most people playing vs AI and PvE all the time and Open Space is a huge waste of opportunity. I'm not saying that it's easy to make the game more enjoyable, it's difficult, however there are game designers for things like that. If you just slap more microtransactions on a game that lacks gameplay for most players, it means that you don't really care about how players see your game.

Also by trying to keep players playing the game or even by getting new players. Yes, you can prevent players from quitting. The game isn't popular and more and more too expensive microtransaction crap will make a fraction of players quit. Also, the game will also have more reasons to be called Pay 2 Win or Pay 2 Progress and even less will come to the game.

 

I haven't seen a single $1.25 paint. I saw a paint for a currency obtainable in game. They actually added GS generators in game, so it's not a "real world currency obtainable only" at this point. So no pay 2 progress here. Sorry. So I assume you would rather see the paint DLCs obtainable only with real money instead of DLCs that are allowing you to skip some time?

 

 

7 hours ago, Gon009 said:

More microtransactions without making players stay is only a short term solution. 

 

But seriously - if you mean by microtransactions things that you have to purchase with the real money - then they are actually much less than 2 years ago. 

 

7 hours ago, Gon009 said:

Games like Robocraft are excellent example of how good gameplay can keep your playerbase huge and that you need a good game designers for this. In case of Robocraft, they did the opposite, they created excellent initial gameplay but they didn't understand why players liked it, after years of bad changes it's a dying game now. Many F2P games show that you don't need anything else than cosmetic microtransactions if you design your game in a really good way.

SC is broken and they need to fix it to get more paying players instead to slap microtransactions everywhere to milk current low number of surviving players.

 

Again. How exactly is giving you options to earn premium currency "milking existing players"? Also I played Robocraft. Went back to SC in two weeks. No, thank you. 

I play competitive SC in PvP and also PvE (speedrun records etc) - I don't play random solo PvP much as most of the games I enjoy involves squads and proper tactics. In random mayhem called PvP skirmish I still won't even queue without a second pilot as this at least has some chance to carry the team. What exactly are you expecting from random skirmish? It's random. 

 

7 hours ago, Gon009 said:

 

No, I'm comparing the SC to games that were here for ~10 years. Like some GameForge games or even BigPoint games. These companies are famous for pushing microtransactions to the point that non-paying users don't have the reason to play. 

 

I haven't seen the rule "you have to make a purchase or your account will be deleted after 35 days of inactivity" in Star Conflict. 

 

 

7 hours ago, Gon009 said:

12h of gameplay to get Every. Single. Node? I doubt it. This is what Deluxe gives. Entire tree, every module and weapon from the start. Tell me how many there are players with 100% unlocked trees here.

Actually 12h of gameplay to build a Waz'got. It didn't have all nodes available at that time. But ranking it up is pretty quick as well as this ship racks up xp very quick.  Maybe 10 hours extra to unlock all the nodes you want (not all) if you have resources for them. Deluxe bundle is an overkill and it actually takes away the fun of watching the ship grow. 

How many players have 100% of the trees? My first answer would be "not many" but then I asked around. I asked in my corp and few others and almost everyone has all nodes unlocked... People I play with are craving some tasks that they can fulfill. Ze'ta brought some relief from watching every single item in game you earned deleted - it's a good, endgame resource sink. Waz'got is pretty cheap if you know what do you want to build. I actually checked that as well - 150 monocrystals + 100 xenocrystals + some basic resources to craft it (that's much less than previously mentioned 12 hours of game play if you are active player and doing corporate missions - at this moment my daily reward is 11 xenocrystals + 10 monocrystals per day just because I played a few battles of seccon a few days ago), some specops to unlock the special nodes and you are  good to go. Till R8 all equipment is very easy obtainable. R9 and higher - yes, you have to put some game play to it. Still nothing scary. 

So again - I have nothing against DLCs that will speed up the process for people. They can just buy stuff. They can't buy a skill, they still have to learn how to use this ship. 

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3 hours ago, OwnageMaster said:

I haven't seen a single $1.25 paint. I saw a paint for a currency obtainable in game. They actually added GS generators in game, so it's not a "real world currency obtainable only" at this point. So no pay 2 progress here. Sorry. So I assume you would rather see the paint DLCs obtainable only with real money instead of DLCs that are allowing you to skip some time?

I didn't say that Paints are pay to progress. It's about things that need at least 10k GS investment. Also, do you know that P2W games like Nostale or DarkOrbit also had a way to get paid items without actually paying? "You can earn it without playing so it's not P2W anymore" is wrong argument, it's the same with pay 2 progress. It's not about the fact that you have to pay and there's no other way, but about the fact that paying can save you hundreds of hours of playing. In my eyes, it starts to be bad when you can just go to work instead of playing the game and then use that money for much much faster progression without actually playing.

 

3 hours ago, OwnageMaster said:

Again. How exactly is giving you options to earn premium currency "milking existing players"?

Are you talking about GS from battles and Fort Muerto Conquest? But can you see how much the price of cosmetic items was inflated? Can you also see that the material and monocrystal gain was heavily reduced? Trade tax takes it all and even more and not everyone will be able to access Fort Muerto rewards.

 

3 hours ago, OwnageMaster said:

I asked in my corp and few others and almost everyone has all nodes unlocked...

Nice, I course I didn't say it's impossible, but I guess there's ton of effort you need to do it. You can write how much hours(and $ if any) they spent for the game to check how much playtime are deluxe bundles worth if you want but I doubt that average playing with ~100-150h can also do it.

 

3 hours ago, OwnageMaster said:

(...)Waz'got is pretty cheap if you know what do you want to build.(...)

I'm not saying anything about earning a Waz'Got or how it was at the beginning or whatever. It's about buying entire tree with all modules ready to use for $$$. It's like mobile games micro transactions but at much larger scale.

 

3 hours ago, OwnageMaster said:

I have nothing against DLCs that will speed up the process for people. They can just buy stuff. They can't buy a skill, they still have to learn how to use this ship. 

Honestly I wouldn't care if not that devs are testing us with this to check how far they can go with it and then every new thing will be behind a wall. The fact that players decide to spend tons of GS to get it even when devs are saying that it will be cheaper one day is even worse. At this point it's guaranteed. Also it could be even worse in the future.

 

Ok, I think that this discussion is pretty pointless at this point. You can reply, I will read it and respect it but I won't reply anymore. It will be better for us in that way.

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5 hours ago, Gon009 said:

It's not about the fact that you have to pay and there's no other way, but about the fact that paying can save you hundreds of hours of playing. 

And do exactly what? You still needs those hundreds of hours to learn. Also there are shortcuts in SC - rarely the grind battle after battle is the only option. 

 

5 hours ago, Gon009 said:

 

Are you talking about GS from battles and Fort Muerto Conquest? But can you see how much the price of cosmetic items was inflated? Can you also see that the material and monocrystal gain was heavily reduced? Trade tax takes it all and even more and not everyone will be able to access Fort Muerto rewards.

Not only that. With the current setup it's pretty easy to get some stuff and trade it. Also prices of cosmetics - they were 200GS single use items (like a can of paint - you had to buy another one if you wanted to change the color on the other ship, or even on the same ship) now they are 500 GS unlockables. There was a short time they were 50GS unlockables. 

Resources - no they are actually the same for last months. Previously they were dropping one or two per game from loot, now you have 3 tasks with 18 hours cooldown that are dropping 12. That's an equivalent of previous 32 battles on average. Monocrystals - I agree. Tasks from Open Space have their rewards reduced by ~30-50%. But also new tasks appeared for seccon, SCL. Not to mention sectors with monocrystals. I'm not that active anymore, but my friendly corp kill squad is getting 70-80 monos daily. So it's just a matter of being active player (being less active player I was I'm getting 20-25 monos per day on average). 10% tax is there to balance the inflation and retain the value of GS. 

 

5 hours ago, Gon009 said:

 

Nice, I course I didn't say it's impossible, but I guess there's ton of effort you need to do it. You can write how much hours(and $ if any) they spent for the game to check how much playtime are deluxe bundles worth if you want but I doubt that average playing with ~100-150h can also do it.

 

Honestly - I was able to unlock all nodes on Waz'got that I needed the same day they were available. So less than 100h. 

 

5 hours ago, Gon009 said:

 

I'm not saying anything about earning a Waz'Got or how it was at the beginning or whatever. It's about buying entire tree with all modules ready to use for $$$. It's like mobile games micro transactions but at much larger scale.

 

It all depends. From what I gather there were only few people that were wondering if they should buy this. And none that I know of bought it. Seriously - what is the point of buying the DLC with all modules unlocked if you can do this the same way with in game currency or just playing? You sound like it was something big - "buying entire tree with all modules ready". Waz'got is cheap. The only thing you need are the crystals that are rewarded from SpecOps mission that are hourly. Seriously - this DLC doesn't make sense. Veteran pilot have this ship already, newbie will not know what to do with that ship. 

 

5 hours ago, Gon009 said:

 

Honestly I wouldn't care if not that devs are testing us with this to check how far they can go with it and then every new thing will be behind a wall. The fact that players decide to spend tons of GS to get it even when devs are saying that it will be cheaper one day is even worse. At this point it's guaranteed. Also it could be even worse in the future.

If you are talking about Pilgrim  - it's just a toy. Fun to play, worse than Aura as a command. Not really a game changer. And with Ze'ta? It was interesting event and I know a person or two that actually had lower GS balance after unlocking those new nodes, most of people I fly with were actually doing the tasks. Now Ze'ta  special nodes are 30% cheaper than they were before, normal nodes don't require neurons at all, making them even more affordable and easier to earn - so how is it worse than it was?

 

6 hours ago, Gon009 said:

Ok, I think that this discussion is pretty pointless at this point. You can reply, I will read it and respect it but I won't reply anymore. It will be better for us in that way.

It was pointless from the point you put SC on the same level as OGame and similar, so I agree. 

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