Error18512

[PvE - Mission] 'Blackwood' Shipyard

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As I've stated in multiple balance threads, The T3 and T4 scenarios are far too difficult to even hope of completing if you are not an a PvE guild with fully fit and decked out raid groups so to speak.

 

Something as simple as reducing Enemy NPC damage and HP by like 10%or 20% would probably make a HUGE difference and make the scenarios at higher levels "Hard" but not "Impossible difficulty".

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Well they are not impossible.

They are hard.

What's the point of playing an easy game ?

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As I've stated in multiple balance threads, The T3 and T4 scenarios are far too difficult to even hope of completing if you are not an a PvE guild with fully fit and decked out raid groups so to speak.

I pugged with 2 groups last night. We beat the first tier 3 scen in very little time(shipyard). Then another group we almost beat maintenance but lost because 1 member dc'd and another(me) died stupidly(forgot there were 3 commanders in last spawn of round 3).

We could have easily 3 manned it if I hadn't died and wasted time on those 3 commanders.

It isn't impossible. You just have to play smart and use cover, which I made the mistake of changing position at a bad time and being focused on by all 3 commanders :s.

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How do you tell what tier the scenario is?

 

I have played with various different ship combinations, my low T1s are often grouped with other T1s of varying power. When I play with 3 of my highest T1 ships, I am sometimes grouped with people playing a T2 ship or two. In the former case, the scenario is very easy, stuff dies fast, we never wipe. In the latter case a lot more tactical play is required to survive, interceptors take longer to kill etc. Bear in mind I am only ever playing with T1 ships. If I am getting into T2 scenarios, what is the cutoff? How is it calculated? How do I tell if it's the easymode or harder?

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Just turn on the queue graph. The command is on the wiki in the chat commands page. It's something like /set clShowMmQueue 2

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Just turn on the queue graph. The command is on the wiki in the chat commands page. It's something like /set clShowMmQueue 2

 

Thanks, this cleared up my issue. It appears there is a small overlap for each tier. Thank you!! :)

 

/set cl_showMmQueueInfo 2

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Hey Dev's; i just wanted to congratulate your on totally xxxx up scenarios with todays implemented patch. Knowing where to begin with the number of problems todays patch will present to players is difficult to determine but i will try.

 

* Round 1 - Capture the beacon. I can understand the challenge presented in having a unlimited amount of enemy ships constantly spawning in vs 4 players trying to slowly capture 3 beacons as well as survive being under constant fire. That statement is fair enough by itself, but the shear rate at which ships spawn in and the volume they amount to (especially when it comes to capturing the 3rd beacon) is a tad overkill to say the least. You have effectively made it impossible for a group to complete this scenario if 1 or 2 of the players happens to die, which unfortunatley is now an extremely realistic; likely and regular problem. With 4 players it can be a little difficult if 1 or 2 of my fellow players arn't piloting frigates for heavy damage, or their ships are not 100% geared to pve with the wisest possible gear equiped for this mission.

 

* Round 2 - Destroying the Gun Turrents. In any of my attempts so far, any team i was with hasn't been able to even get close to successfully starting this mission well, let alone finish it. It's beyond difficult and a little unresonable to expect players to take out that many defences when yet again you have played the lazy unlimited enemy spawning card. None of the players i was with were even able to take out 1 of the main turrents due to us being forced to trying to survive the constant onslaught of npcs before we could even find the time to begin an offensive on the main objective.

 

* Round 3 - Havn't got this far on the new scenario.

 

How is it a player like myself can comfortabley handle the previous challenge of defeating the punisher, be it with many failures, but also many successful completed kills; now be almost stuck at this latest challenge? I can't help but wonder if the developers even tested this new scenario on a level playing field; ie not playing it with all 4 testers using tier 4 ships with bis gear.

 

P.S. An options to change the chat font would be appreciated as of now it has become skewed, a little odd looking and difficult to read. Also, when you try to add a friend manually by typing in their name, the text input icon will regularly "tab-out" by itself every time you try to enter a character.

 

I wish you developers with take the time to test things out yourself a little more often instead of relying on paying others to do so, or waiting for complaints from your player base. 

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Did they add a new scenario? Because this sounds like the old sabotage scenario they pulled.

Also, no mention in patch notes about them re-adding it.

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Sounds just like the old version of it.

As it seems, it is hard but feasible. I don't see anything wrong in that.

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Hey Dev's; i just wanted to congratulate your on totally xxxx up scenarios with todays implemented patch. Knowing where to begin with the number of problems todays patch will present to players is difficult to determine but i will try.

 

* Round 1 - Capture the beacon. I can understand the challenge presented in having a unlimited amount of enemy ships constantly spawning in vs 4 players trying to slowly capture 3 beacons as well as survive being under constant fire. That statement is fair enough by itself, but the shear rate at which ships spawn in and the volume they amount to (especially when it comes to capturing the 3rd beacon) is a tad overkill to say the least. You have effectively made it impossible for a group to complete this scenario if 1 or 2 of the players happens to die, which unfortunatley is now an extremely realistic; likely and regular problem. With 4 players it can be a little difficult if 1 or 2 of my fellow players arn't piloting frigates for heavy damage, or their ships are not 100% geared to pve with the wisest possible gear equiped for this mission.

 

* Round 2 - Destroying the Gun Turrents. In any of my attempts so far, any team i was with hasn't been able to even get close to successfully starting this mission well, let alone finish it. It's beyond difficult and a little unresonable to expect players to take out that many defences when yet again you have played the lazy unlimited enemy spawning card. None of the players i was with were even able to take out 1 of the main turrents due to us being forced to trying to survive the constant onslaught of npcs before we could even find the time to begin an offensive on the main objective.

 

* Round 3 - Havn't got this far on the new scenario.

 

Round 1: easy enough. hug beacons one by one and shoot anything getting close.

 

Round 2: easy enough. focus on destroying flak cannons. These hurt. Then take down the turrets.

 

Round 3: between fighting off infinite waves of spawns and those missile emplacements having an extreme amount of hitpoints and cycling an invulnerability shield around 2 at a time, this is basically a dps race that requires good coordination. There's probably a trick to it, but even with decently fitted T4 ships this round is extremely tough. If even just 1 guy dies here, the spawns will quickly overwhelm the remaining players.

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Ran this scenario three times yesterday with all T3 ships and won every time. And we had never seen this scenario before.

 

The key is to use cover. That's it. Don't stand in the open to get shot to pieces. The missile launchers can't hit you when you duck down, so pour on the damage until you need to recover shield/hull. Then get out of LOS.

 

A couple of ships with hull/shield regeneration will help immensely. We had 2 frigates with hull/shield/pulsar and they were the bedrock for the team. 

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Ran this scenario three times yesterday with all T3 ships and won every time. And we had never seen this scenario before.

The key is to use cover. That's it. Don't stand in the open to get shot to pieces. The missile launchers can't hit you when you duck down, so pour on the damage until you need to recover shield/hull. Then get out of LOS.

A couple of ships with hull/shield regeneration will help immensely. We had 2 frigates with hull/shield/pulsar and they were the bedrock for the team.

The tactics are the same as when they were tier 1/2. But the difficulty is when the commanders pop out or while avoiding mobs/launchers you run into the other.

Just like other scenarios, tough with bad team, moderately difficult but very doable with a good team.

Tldr - TEAMWORK!!!!!

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In the whole scenario, and the last phase, the key imo, is to have 2 ships with support (ideally 2 frigates) and these ships must be on each side of the middle missile launcher, hide behind the big ship (the 3 missiles launchers are at 1,5km max).

In these position, they could fire without be fired by the launcher. I have seen that the missile launcher target the near ship.

When elite pops, all the team must focus.

(sorry for my english...)

But the real key is : teamwork in fact.

One question plz :

How can i know what's the level (T1/T2/T3) of the scenario i'm playing ?

Imagine i have a fighter T2 and 2 frigates T3 and i play scenario.

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One question plz :

How can i know what's the level (T1/T2/T3) of the scenario i'm playing ?

Imagine i have a fighter T2 and 2 frigates T3 and i play scenario.

 

Use:

/set cl_showMmQueueInfo 2

 

It will show you what scenario level you are eligible for when you queue. It shows there's a small crossover where you're eligible for two tiers, if that's the case then you just have to guess AFAIK, sorry.

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I think the main problem of T3 Scenarios are a lot of people coming fresh out of T2 and attempting their luck at them, while having picked up some bad habits from earlier scenarios.

 

These issues apply to both scenarios:

Issue 1: Overestimating Pulsar Damage Scaling

In T1/T2 Pulsars will destroy everything but Elite Mobs.

In T3 Pulsars will destroy Interceptors, put a bit of a scratch on Fighters and not do a whole lot of anything against Frigates. That's before Elite Mobs.

 

Issue 2: Torpidiots still not realizing they nuke their own team.

In T1/T2 you often can get away with the occasional hit from a less intelligent teammate.

In T3 suddenly losing all your shield without anything you can do about it, usually spells death.

 

Issue 3: People overestimate their defensive capabilities

In T1/T2, you can sit in a ball of npc enemies and laugh off their damage while you kill them one by one.

In T3 doing the same thing will get you killed. In general, people remain far too stationary. The AI is really bad at hitting moving targets, yet most players insist to not move.

 

 

In addition, these 3 issues lead to the exploitation of certain oddities and map design. You'll often see folks fly to very specific spots, because for example, the Punishers Turn Ratio makes it impossible to fly in there. Or because the AI doesn't understand how to hit a target if most of it is stuck in map geometry. Or people abusing the targeting AI of the missile launchers with fast ships (that one might be an intentional feature though). These things make it so that people still don't need to drop their bad scenario habits and can continue as they have done before. And in T3, unless you get the right team for that, you lose. Thus T3 appears that much harder than it actually is.

The specific issues I mentioned above, all lead to problems in T3. Especially the pulsar thing. It's a powerful tool and in the earlier scenarios it keeps the spawns in check. But it's simply not enough in T3+. Also many people will insist it is pointless to destroy the defending ships since they'd just respawn anyways. While that is true to a degree, they will overwhelm players if not kept in check and even more importantly, it's very easy to kill them off fast enough - if you try, so that you have an entire cycle on the missile launchers without any enemies.

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I think the main problem of T3 Scenarios are a lot of people coming fresh out of T2 and attempting their luck at them, while having picked up some bad habits from earlier scenarios.

<cut out>

While that is true to a degree, they will overwhelm players if not kept in check and even more importantly, it's very easy to kill them off fast enough - if you try, so that you have an entire cycle on the missile launchers without any enemies.

Completely agree. But those map exploits allow for a bit of a learning curve in a rather difficult set of a scenarios. Unless you bring in tier 4's these scenarios are generally quite difficult.

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to dEnamed

problem of T3 scenarios is that there is no T3 scenarios only T4.

And looks like this problem exists quite long. I'm tired of this staff. -_____-

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== Star Conflict OBT v 0.7.7 ==

Scenarios: Sabotage

* Scenario "Sabotage" is now available for the difficulty level T3-T4.

0.7.7 was out February 21st, 2013

You are getting tired really fast my dear sir.

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T3 scenarios are like any of the others. Once you have figured out how to beat them, it's just an exercise in time -> money.

 

Pulsars are your friend if you fly a frigate. And if you know what places to go, you can stand virtually still for the whole battle. The AI has serious problems fighting ships that are flush with a large object (like the battleship in 'Sabotage'). They will founder about inside pulsar range without doing much damage to you.

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