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[PvP] Combat Recon

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This is my favorite scenario. I fly Fed frigate and enjoy the challenge of being a captain. Sometimes I live and sometimes I don't.

 

The real decider isn't what ship I'm flying, it's down to which side has the best teamwork.

 

Great stuff!

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I find this mode to range between very interesting and the most boring mode I am stuck to play through.

 

Thinking on it I do have a suggestion, switch the secondary victory condition to damage delt to the opposition commander, not kills.

 

This is due to the fact, after the first 3 minutes the secondary victory condition creates a preverse reason for the entire team to camp.

Also it is the only game mode in arcade that I can think of that activly punishes people for going towards the objective.

 

Detonation, you get the bomb and die, no big deal if your lucky your extra pickup may make the team win if there is a draw on number of sites destroyed.

Combat recon, attack the opposition commander and die, now you just feed the opposition a kill in order to win the game.

 

When any side decides to just camp it and never attack it becomes the most boring game ever as the commander for the other side. Sit do nothing for 6+ minutes, fun times. Watch the kill to death ratio to see if your side will win.

 

Where as I fully appreciate that it maybe possible to attack as the comander if thigs arnt looking too hot for your team. I do not fly ships designed to take on more than 3 people and survive. If the opposition is in one mass camping clump I cannot risk getting too close, nor effect the outcome at all.

 

Not sure if you would want to make it hull damage or just damage in general to the commander, but I feel this would go along way to preventing this mode falling to a long game of team deathmatch. Specifically team deathmathch where I as the commander cannot participate.

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[bUG] ??

 

It happened to me at least 3 times to respawn when my captain is dead from a long time.

 

(I dont missunderstand with the case where you start to respawn BEFORE your captain is dead)

 

 

=>  In all this cases, my captain was died, and then me too a few moment LATER. 

 

THEN

 

=> My remaining team achieve some desesperate attack move, and kill the opponent captain.

 

THEN a few second later ( at least 3 time I can confirm 100% )

 

=> My ship condition switch from "DESTROYED" to spawning, and I came back in game really fast.

 

Remember that I have been in "DESTROYED" condition for a long time, no possible error.

 

 

My question is : Is this planned intentionnaly, or is this a bug ? I didnt find any notice about this on game mode description.

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I had it happen once when someone else that was still alive disconnected. Could be coincidence though and be a bug regardless.

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I've generally enjoyed this gametype, but I do have some issues:

 

First of all, the captain is too easy to kill.

This is simply because you're the #1 priority. Killing you means winning the match, anything beyond that doesn't matter. Only interceptors tend to survive for long in this gametype, because they have the mobility to actually escape from someone MWD'ing onto them. Frigates can tank damage, but a proper setup like http://forum.gaijinent.com/index.php?/topic/13607-arcade-combat-reconnaissance/?p=183391'>Kyoss mentions will still take a tanked out Frigate single-handedly, If you bring a couple buddies, there's no chance. An invulnerability shield + MWD into the captain or just self destructing next to him after you've taken out his shields and are low on health yourself is often enough.

 

Second of all, there is no incentive to fight

The captain is too important to fight, the best you can do is push slightly behind the main force, providing support. But if anyone breaks through the lines, you're pretty much fucked, so people camp under an umbrella of frigates with support modules, only half the teams actually end up fighting. 

 

Note that whether you push or camp, a single MWD interceptor/fighter dropping on the captain with disable abilities and invulnerability + MWD or Self Destruct is enough to kill him regardless.

 

What needs to be tackled:

1. More incentive to get into the fight

2. A tougher Captain

 

What would be nice:

- End round bonus for the captain. Credits, guaranteed loot drop, 1 extra loot chance; just something.

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Please fix that i get kicked for inactivity while looking on the map. Sometimes you need a while to assess the Battlefield and type advice.... Hillarious that i get kicked in spite of typing all the time btw

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The kicked for inactivity thing is pretty bad.  Happened to me yesterday.  I was doing the usual "hide behind a rock" strategy after I got conscripted into captaincy, and despite the fact that I was moving around a little (adjusting my position slightly but still staying within the same 50m^3 probably) and typing in team chat, about 3 minutes before the end of the match it kicked me for "inactivity".

 

It let me back in afterwards, but by that time it had drafted some interceptor towards the front lines as captain.  I have to admit that I was impressed at the team's ability to cope with it, we managed to save the inty from immediate harm once I got back in, but needless to say the match ultimately didn't go so well for us.

 

The other bit of feedback I have about this game mode, which somewhat echoes other poster's points, is that it's just deathly dull to play as captain most of the time.  If you try and push forward with the whole team, you're basically signing your own death warrant since the entire enemy team is giong to be targeting you, and it's not like you can sneak up on them.  So you're left with camping behind a rock or wall somewhere.  And either the enemy team sends a well-coordinated assault (never really seen this happen) in which case you basically sit there and hope that the rest of your team takes them out while dodging/running a bit, or you just sit there and watch the lone interceptor that keeps flying into your team's pack of camping frigates get blown to bits every minute or so.

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Please just remove this bullshit mode.

 

I mean seriously this mode has like one million flaws, with 5 frigates and a fighter camping behind a rock, with all sorts of repair and buff moduls buffing the captain awaiting the 1 or 2 attackers because the other team consists of 5 frigates and a fighter camping...

 

Even if you somehow manage to scratch a captains hull while being hammered by 5 pulsars at once, it will just get repaired.

At least give us an option to opt out of this mode.

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This mode has a lot of potential, but it's currently not much fun. 

 

My proposal:    It's called Combat Reconnaissance, but no one actually does any recon!  Make it so NO ONE knows who the captains are, not even the captains.  The identification of a captain happens when someone tags them with a spy drone, making the spy module useful and improving the mode at the same time.  Maybe the captain is the guy zipping around in a Dwarf doing vanguard duty, no one knows until he dies or is tagged.

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Noticing a trend on Captain suiciding, either via the back space button, going out of bounds, flying into pandora sun, or charging the enemy. Then they go about bragging about them trolling their team. 
 

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This mode has a lot of potential, but it's currently not much fun. 

 

My proposal:    It's called Combat Reconnaissance, but no one actually does any recon! 

 

Recon is essential in this mode. You need to protect your captain, and then have a couple of picket ships running 'recon' further out. Otherwise you could get ambushed. The recon ships also let you know if the enemy team is moving en masse - leaving the enemy captain exposed.

 

When played properly, combat reconnaissance is what this mission is all about!

 

Make it so NO ONE knows who the captains are, not even the captains.  The identification of a captain happens when someone tags them with a spy drone, making the spy module useful and improving the mode at the same time.  Maybe the captain is the guy zipping around in a Dwarf doing vanguard duty, no one knows until he dies or is tagged.

 

It would be an interesting idea to have a new combat mode where one player is a "surprise package" of some kind. But I think it would be better as a new additional mode rather than a replacement. Knowing who the captain is creates the crux around which the tactics of this game mode revolve.

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It needs to be made more obvious if YOU are the captain.

 

On several occasions, folks, even me at one time, zoom into the heat of battle without realising they're the captain. For one, it's easy to miss the tiny skull icon or your name on the HUD and I forgot captains alone could see where every enemy was. For another, if the captain is stuck on the load screen, he won't know he is the captain until after the client finishes loading.

 

It should be like CTF in Tribes: Ascend when you pick up the enemy flag where it then says "TAKE THE ENEMY FLAG TO YOUR FLAG STAND." Flash up in big letters what your objective is. "YOU ARE THE CAPTAIN, STAY COVERED AND CO-ORDINATE YOUR TEAM" or "YOU HAVE THE EMP BOMB, DELIVER IT TO THE ENEMY BEACONS" or something. Those would work wonders if they flashed up every minute or so.

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I am a word-that-has-been-redacted-but-generally-means-i-cant-play-or-havn't-played-this-for-long who has only seen this mode at T1/T2 levels. 

Here are my impressions:

 

At T1, this mode is characterized by a mutual captain rush, followed by clean up by the team that got their captain kill first, or regular team deathmatch if both captains die. Captains don't survive for very long and success usually means you took out more of the enemy ships while your captain was still alive than they took out when their captain was alive. 

 

Which sucks because it's all random and it feels like a bunch of Aces flying in circles. 

 

At T2, this mode is characterized by long distance camping either in open space with a couple of frigates or behind a rock with smaller ships and nuking anybody who comes close. Victory is achieved by the team who has less idiots to try to 1-v-team the other team's captain and more patient players who are willing to wait 15 minutes for the round to end and win on points gained from roasting the other team's "idiots".

 

Which sucks because you spend 15 minutes parked behind an asteroid instead of playing an exciting, fast paced, fluid game (this is arcade, yes?). 

 

I think the solution at T2 is to force one of the teams to attack. Make the match asymmetric. One team being the aggressor will automatically lose if they don't kill the enemy captain. And to make it easier on the aggressor team, once they kill the enemy captain, they win immediately without having to worry about clean up. 

 

Dunno how this looks like in T3. havn't gotten there yet. 

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@Aptest -

I think you just need more empire interceptors. Warp in after your teammate has damaged the enemy captain, then dump all your rockets into their bum. Works almost every time assuming that you don't instaexplode due to mines and junk.

I haven't really seen a match where they've successfully defended without like, tons o' mines in T2. It doesn't take much teamwork to attack a captain with 2 empire interceptors with microwarp, but it does take some work to defend against it, thus your odds in pub matches are pretty good that the captains will die so as long as your team is aggressive enough to sneak at least 1 person behind the giant mess of a mid-fight and have another microwarp to get the 2v1.

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What if this mode was altered to make the captain invincible until certain requirements are fulfilled?

It would shift the whole "oh no i'm the captain" to "yes! i'm the captain!" and actualy create quite an interesting situation during the match, it would become more similiar to a team deathmatch with a hint of spice

 

Regarding the current mode, i find that the captain being always visible is a bad thing as it provokes rush in tactics or camping, instead i think it would be alot more interesting if each team didn't know which one of the enemy ships was the captain and maybe even better if only contact between the 2 captains could reveal eachother

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Idea that just occurred to me. What if, after the captain dies, He/She doeas get to respawn, but it takes an extra long time--say, at least one minute. During the wait, the remaining players have a countdown somewhere on the screen. If the players can survive long enough for the captain to respawn, then they get to respawn, themselves.

 

This came to me because there is no incentive to keep playing if the team can't win after the captain dies, except by killing the opposing captain, and then the opposing team. That condition is practically impossible with better players on the opposition. I feel the mode needs an incentive built into it for the captainless team to keep playing, other than to provide a kill count for the opponent.

 

Alternatively, the captainless team could be able to draw or win if they can keep at least one ship alive by the end of the game clock. That would also be a reason to keep playing after their captain's death.

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This mode definitely needs a major redesign.  In its current incarnation it's the worst xxxx ever in pug matches and nothing but a giant fifteen minute turtling game that comes down entirely to which team has the less xxxx players that can sit around carefully camping out for the entire match. 

 

I'd rather see the role of captain be given to an NPC capital ship of some sort and make it into a fun fleet duel instead of this awful xxxx we have now.

 

Recon is essential in this mode. You need to protect your captain, and then have a couple of picket ships running 'recon' further out. Otherwise you could get ambushed. The recon ships also let you know if the enemy team is moving en masse - leaving the enemy captain exposed.

Lolwut?  There is absolutely no recon required whatsoever in this mode because the captain can see everybody and relay that information to the team.  What wacky world do you live in?

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They need to change the captain ships to two large Dreadnoughts duking it out at extreme range.  Each team needs to destroy points on the enemy dreadnought, and as the dreads take damage the team loses certain bonuses, eventually ending the ability to spawn.  Have the dreads move around the map, and suddenly the game involves a bit more then camping or making suicide runs.

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I don't believe the dreadnought thing is a good idea, simply becouse it will simply force entire fleets of frigates with torpedo and disintegrators at 10k+ distance and whoever has the most wins

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:excl:  Crazy Idea

 

 

Replace Captain with Beacons ?

- 2 beacons per team

- Lose even 1 beacon and your team cannot respawn

 

- Everything else remain the same inc. victory conditions

- No beacon points obviously, just kill score + time that's it.

 

prCXWvy.jpg

 

 

 

What does this solve?

 

1. camping complaints

2. game ending suicide nukes

3. long timeout games now that it's easier to end the match

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i like flying my fighters myself and when im chosen as captain i feel like im garanteed to die unless i always take a frigate in my lineup which i may not want to do , i do like the idea of having the team vote for there captain  or at the very least a slight defence buff to those who are picked as captain ?

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